Engine choice - Cant Decide

[MR22ZZ]

Something that I've been curious about lately is the idea of putting a 1NZ-FE into one of these and a small turbo. Would be super light and make similar power to the 4A-GE I would say, but be lighter on the juice being a misley 1.5L.

Quite a compact engine too so would be no trouble at all for the smallish TA22 engine bay.

Gearboxes may again be an issue though.

[connection]

also, forgot to add:

1: Have the motor rebuilt with a metal head-gasket and if i can't afford forged pistons. CA’s are getting on, so a freshen up in the beginning will relieve hassles down the line. (Highly recommended)

doing this basically absorbs the main reason for doing a ca18det conversion, by rebuilding it, its no longer that "cheap" conversion. in this case, your better off doing a 4agte. same price, no fundemental issues, better motor all round really, it just costs more, but by rebuilding a ca18, thats no longer the issue.

5: Use an aftermarket computer. AP Engineering PoweFC is a good plug in choice. If done right a remap can save lots of cash.

a ca18det power FC is becoming more difficult to find, this is nolonger a cheap option. get an Adaptronic, $1000 retail, and wire it in. the amount of shit they can do is amazing for the price. powerFC's for a ca18det go for like $1500 with a handcontroller. waste. of. money.

[tomvale13]

Something that I've been curious about lately is the idea of putting a 1NZ-FE into one of these and a small turbo.

whats that out of?

1.5 ltr rwd?

[MR22ZZ]

it's out of the echo so it's a FWD engine, hence why gearboxes could be an issue. Though I would assume you could use whatever you use for a 4A as they both use C series gearboxes in E-W applications.

[tomvale13]

Hmm.. cool.

:-)

Same thing could be said of the 5efe (which can easily be made 5efte) - Mates to C series bellhousing.



(apologies if I have misunderstood something)

5e's can be had for under $200 in good nic, $380 for spool forged rods, $100 for 4efte pistons and voila! Well not really, but add mani and t25/td04/vf series turbo with some 440cc inj's and you'd easily see 150kw, efficiently too.

Surely there'd be heaps of work for either the 1nz or 5e to go in though being fwd motors..?

[MR22ZZ]

yeah 1NZ is just the newer verson of the same thing really. VVTi is a plus.

but it's an unknown as far as fitting in RWD application goes so mounts, inlet and exhaust manifolds etc would all have to be custom, but you get that.

[LeeRoy]

I would also recommend Linden for the mounts etc. He's also done a variety of conversions with the 22. atm we are doing mine with the 3s, there is also one there with an SR, and i'm sure he's done one with a 4a in the past but if not theres definately a few on here to have a look at.

[GEMTA22]

Leeroy do you any details of the 22 with the sr20 in it ? Was it a big hassle with the space, or is it still in the build and to early to state anything ?
MR22ZZ
The one 1nz would be really light weight and weak in terms of turbo application aswell, plus alot of customisation with gearbox bellhousing and fitment. They were designed for NA and weak internals i think its best if it stayed NA.
TomVale
The 4efte turbo from the gt starlet 1.3 litre engine would seem like it would require also alot of custimisation for rwd application.

connection
Yeh your right it would absorb alot of the cost and its just best to buy a ca18det block with low k's and strong equal psi in all cylinders. Plus there readily available to its not a real biggie if it does happen to break. Oh and cheers for the oil issue tip clarified it up. I spoke to few tuners aswell and nistune chip installed fully tuned is around $750. What your thoughts on that ?

Spoke to hills motorsport today and i don't think ill be using them. Has anyone got work done from them before ?

[LeeRoy]

Send Linden a pm on here. His user name is 'The Real Roadrunner'

I'll see if I can get you some SR22 ta22 pics. It is a pretty damn tight conversion though. Was there anything you want to see in particular.

Apart from any T variant engine, nothing is a bolt in conversion, and basically everything else will require a fair amount of fab worth. The biggest benefit you have is that the celica is so simple that doing anything is quite easy in comparison to that of newer cars.

[connection]

L

connection
Yeh your right it would absorb alot of the cost and its just best to buy a ca18det block with low k's and strong equal psi in all cylinders. Plus there readily available to its not a real biggie if it does happen to break. Oh and cheers for the oil issue tip clarified it up. I spoke to few tuners aswell and nistune chip installed fully tuned is around $750. What your thoughts on that ?

well, if you spend $750 on reprogramming the ECU, it does a few things, some good, but mostly bad

- initial outlay is cheaper then a full blown aftermarket ECU
- you will be almost forced to use that same workshop that reprogrammed it
- by adding the chip, you just make some things adjustable, fuel maps, rev limit ect. not much more. its $750 for not much, just so the TUNER can change things. you wont be able to touch it still.

i think you best off with a full aftermarket ECU, such as adaptronic or haltech. this enables you to change things whenever you feel like it (just plug in the laptop) alot of tuners can use them, and its just more futureproof.

i just dont think spending $750 for a "chip" that only the tuner can control that is very much limited in terms of what it can do, where you can get an adaptronic for $1000, wire it in and pay the $300ish to get it tuned properly.

to be honest, a "chip" is more suited to your average hektik **** who just upped the stock boost type thing.

[LeeRoy]

i think you best off with a full aftermarket ECU, such as adaptronic or haltech. this enables you to change things whenever you feel like it (just plug in the laptop) alot of tuners can use them, and its just more futureproof.

i just dont think spending $750 for a "chip" that only the tuner can control that is very much limited in terms of what it can do, where you can get an adaptronic for $1000, wire it in and pay the $300ish to get it tuned properly.

Amen. It's standalone or go home.

to be honest, a "chip" is more suited to your average hektik **** who just upped the stock boost type thing.

This I disagree.

As you move into cars with more features and controls etc, there comes a point where you cant ditch the ecu altogether while maintaining functionality of all the creature comforts. This is where a chip really shines. Think of something like a BMW, new Commodore, new Toyota, Lexus etc.

[GEMTA22]

I just like to know how close to the firewall the engine sits and the placement of the FMIC.
Was it inside or thru the front grill, dont go into any hassle i was just curious and liked to know if you already had pictures on your computer.

Linden seems to be the go to person, alot of people recommending himself. So ill defenetly give him a visit and see what he has to say, when im ready.

River- to rebore and turbo a 2tg but where would i get the forged internal from ? Complete custom one off forged internals for the 3tgte would sound really expensive. How about parts like water pumps and gaskets ? As i mentioned before its not really viable as theres a alternative with parts in abundance.
Hope you don't hate me too much . As the 22 will surely set ships to sail like the girl from the helen of troy

[connection]

well in this context, i stand by my comment

beacuse...

we are talking about a ta22 here, not a engine conversion into a lexus with 100 "creature comforts"

its not that i disagree with you dissagreeing with me its just it dont see it as a worthy option, it costs alot, for minimal reward.

and isnt that what i mean? creature comforts, BMW, new commodore etc etc... chances are they're only like raising the stock boost level or adding extractors or something wack that would even require a "chip". you wont need an aftermarket ecu if thats all your doing.

[GEMTA22]

Connection ill be looking at a stand alone ecu, yeh i understand where your coming from.
The adoptronic ecu would be most beneficial and even tho im not running a big mod list.
Pretty much just comprising of a t2871r turbo, dump and 3" exhhaust, FMIC.

Hence why i initially thought the chip would be sufficient as it wasn't a serious mod list.

[Grega]

gemta22, nistune installed in a std JECs ECU is a little more than $450.
(i'm looking at doing the same with my VLT)

for $300 matey you're not getting much of a tune per se.
what i'd suggest you're getting is a copy of the ca18det prom re-loaded onto the std kal with not much more....

remember nissan / toyota ect spend thousands of hours mapping tunes (albeit for emissions in alot of cases) they are extremely good coming out of the factory. for $300 i don't reckon you'd be getting much....my last tune cost me $1k and 3 days worth of time which no drivability was lost (although he did used to work for GM, lol)