Wideband O2 sensors, a few questions.

[The Witzl]

i never let my sensor heat up for more than 10 seconds before starting the 18RGE.... that was just enough time to let the fuel pumps prime up and me put the car in neutral.

[JZA70 R]

The other thing i find amusing in this thread is people comparing these aftermarket wideband sensors accuracy to a dynamometer... just remember most of the wideband units use a bosch sensor, now guess what sensor the dynodynamics dynamometer uses? ...people probably think that because the big bad dyno cost $50,000 it must be more accurate... wrong. You should be comparing the dynos accuracy to a LC-1 not the other way around.

For starters most people with stand-alone wideband units install the sensor directly into their exhaust system, much closer to the source of the gas than a dyno ever will. A common problem with dyno's is when you install the exhaust tip mounted sensor, its subject to cooler / distorted gas which if you have any exhaust leaks, will be contaminated with foriegn oxygen which will effect your air fuel ratio's. perhaps an even bigger problem is some cannon style mufflers or any tip with an increased diameter than the actual exhaust system, will suck fresh air back into the tip or muffler skewing the AFR's so they fly off the top of the screen, ive seen this happen to a mate of mine, the car was untunable with that exhaust system fitted to the car.

If anything a LC-1 using the digital output is more accurate than any conventional dyno. Its only when you use the analogue outputs from the LC-1 you may be subject to voltage discrepancies due to voltage drop against different grounding points for each output on the LC-1. Which can affect your logged air fuel ratio's.

The digital output on the LC-1 is not programmable. Its a true representation of your actual AFR's, and i would trust it over any dyno, any day.

[Phildo]

NOW THAT is a farkin interesting bit of discussion.

JZA70 R: Would you trust a dyno o2 sensor over the LC-1 if they sampled/bolted to the exhaust from the same point?

[YLD-16L]

Interestingly the Mainline dyno we had a dyno day at on the weekend ran a TechEdge unit for A:F readings.

Their unit read spot on with the A:F I tuned my car to the previous day (I tune with a 3A2 tech edge unit). I'll compare with an Autronic meter on a Dyno Dynamics dyno soon.

[JZA70 R]

JZA70 R: Would you trust a dyno o2 sensor over the LC-1 if they sampled/bolted to the exhaust from the same point?

depends how the dyno interfaces the sensor. however if the sensor is upstream of the cat in the exhaust then thats a really good start.

[styler]

joined this thread late but for what its worth i also was choosing a wideband setup and had a good look at all the brands and settled on a innovate motorsports kit for a few reasons, most important accuracy and self calibrating as well as data features.

heres an interesting read:

http://www.innovatemotorsports.com/r...B_Shootout.pdf

[Esteban]

Yep I've got two tech-edge units and while I've used them little, my mate used my original unit at his workshop for quite some time. I built it too.

Started building a tailpipe sniffer last weekend for the original unit, which will make it more versatile.

Adam, you need to fix your stem seals before putting a WBO2 on the MR2 :-) I can only imagine Quick Sensor Death (tm) when they fill with oil

[YLD-16L]

I've got a sniffer pipe for mine and it does come in very handy, seems to work pretty well too. Not as quick to respond though as when the sensor is mounted further upstream obviously.

[chris davey]

Just on the topic of replacing a narrowband with a wideband: I was told when fitting my Techedge unit with bosch sensor that the sensor should be about 1m away from the turbo whereas a narrowband should be a lot closer (like 20cm or so). So if this is correct, I wouldn't be using the same bung for a wideband.

Also agree with Todd re dynos with the tail pipe sniffer. When I ran with open pipes last time and the o2 sensor is only about 10cm from the exit of the exhause I was getting about 50:1 readings Interestingly, on boost it seemed to be the same as before so I guess with all the exhaust gasses coming out very quickly no additional air could get back to the sensor. Either way, I am fitting a bit of extra pipe so that I get 100% accurate readings again.

Also, when I had full exhaust, my Techedge 2e0 read to .1 accuracy to the dyno fellas wideband.

[JZA70 R]

i wasnt aware of any narrowband (oem) sensors using the same style bung as the bosch wideband sensors... therefor you would be forced to install the bung supplied with your bosch sensor. but yes there are definately limits to where you should place your wideband sensor.

[infotechplus]

As this seems to be the only thread here related to wideband tuning I thought I'd use it to post a couple of questions/comments.

I'm looking at buying a wideband unit to assist with tuning the Aristo's 2JZGTE engine. I already have a full exhaust system, induction kit (K&N), Turbosmart BOV plumbed into an aftermarket intercooler, and a GReddy PRofec e-01.

There are several units on the market, both here and OS but the two most people tend to come back to are the INNOVATE units and the TECH EDGE stuff.

The INNOVATE wideband kits seem to get great writeups but their own FORUM is full of complaints from users about the products and the aftersales support. A couple of people on here (who's opinions I respect) have mentioned the TECH EDGE kits.

I've done some research and reading of a general nature regarding A/F tuning, and using the equipment, but the TECH EDGE website seems to be 'overwhelming' in its information and options. Is it just there to impress or do these kits really work?

I'm looking at a permanent install as opposed to a 'mobile' unit - main unit and gauge/display - along the lines of the 3B1 + 4m cable + 7200 sensor + LD02 display.

I'm looking for advice and comments from users of any of these systems. I also found the NGK system for about the same price but read somewhere it was not a comparable unit to the INNOVATE/TECH EDGE units.

PS. Does the HALTECH Haltuner kit (unit + display $590) require a HALTECH ECU to function or is it stand-alone?

Thanks in advance,

Cheers,

Peter

[YLD-16L]

Hi Peter,

I run the 3A2 unit, 7200 sensor, 4m cable (so I can tune various other cars using a sniffer pipe) and LX1 display and they have been great. The 3A2 has quite a few functions some of which I have not used yet but at the moment I have it set up for A:F (obviously), MAP and RPM so this allows me to log/use the lap top to run load Vs rpm matrix for tuning etc.

Up until now thought I have just tuned straight off the LX1 display and not used the new lap top software free from the techedge site.

For what it sounds like you are after the 3B1 will do more than enough, I initially was planning to get the 3B1 as well but found the 3A2 to be a little better/different in features (USB being a good one) (minus of course the bling aluminium extruded case) and the same level of accuracy so went with that.

I currently have my setup lent to someone from this forum and they were quite impressed with the unit when they used it.

I found the techedge site somewhat overwhelming at first too, they are fair tech geeks that's for sure. I think the big decider for me over the Innovate stuff was the info I got from the Innovate forums as you have already mentioned and the fact That techedge is 15 minutes from my place in the event of needing some help or warranty (which I haven't need after nearly a year of use).

Cheers.

[JP]

The haltech looks to be a rebadged Innovative LC-1 with an XD gauge with haltech logo on it.

I need to buy another wideband for a new car I'm building, currently undecided between a techedge and an LC-1. Will probably come down to whatever's cheaper. With the LC-1 you need to ensure you install it correctly following the wiring instructions, if you dont, you will have issues. I own three LC-1's which are permanently installed in my cars, haven't had any problems with them as they're wired properly.

[infotechplus]

"You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to YLD-16L again."

"You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to JP again."

Thanks guys. That's why I love this community - quick and informative from people who've used the gear!

The TECHEDGE kit is local(which is a +++) and I think I might go with them, after a little more research

Cheers,

Peter

[YLD-16L]

You can always give Peter and techedge a call if stuff doesn't make sense to you on their site. He was quite helpful for me.

You have PM too.