3sgte Limits???

[Joshstix]

Yep there are plenty of people spinning the 5S cranks to 8500-9000 rpm regularly. All of them are on cranks with 3S size big ends as far as I know though, the weight of the 5S size big ends and rods could be a bit of an issue at those revs. Turning the crank for a 3S size big end can either ruin it or actually make it less likely to crack depending on how well the machining is done. If an insufficient fillet is used then it will be seriously weakened.

From what I've seen the 5S cranks are extremely simmilar to the 3S cranks, both forged steel and fully counterweighted etc.

[Shakotan_Aaron]

have not read thread.

this maybe a repeat...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wB2hVXchxCk

777hp 3sgte drag ae86

apparently thats a t78/t88 turbo

[MWP]

this maybe a repeat...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wB2hVXchxCk

Yup, a whole 5 replies ago

[Shakotan_Aaron]

the page i opened was page 7 with only one other post in it.. so disreguard it then.

any motor can be tops with enough money thrown at it. even shitty ones..

[ae85 trueno]

If you have had the opportunity to put a 5sfe crank beside a gen2 gen3 there is a vast difference in quality.
Not sure whether either is forged {someone else maybe able to answer that} but the 3sge crank has a basic knife edge and is well counter weighted unlike the 5sfe.

[ae85 trueno]

picture of 3sge / 5sfe

[Shakotan_Aaron]

i cannot workout why aussies continually insist on using shit bottom ends just to gain a few extra cc's.

perhaps in a daily it would make some sense but in a performance app for i dont see it.

5s botton end with 3s head, just like the corolla guys, 7afe bottom end with a 4ag head. plus the 7a crank is only 6bolt vs 8bolt.

id rather have the original shorter stroke (more rev happy) and a bottom end that will take a thrashing.

if you look to the jap companies, when they stroke a motor they do it properly. they use stroker cranks and rods, not steal junk gear from junk motors

just my 2c

[ae85 trueno]

Ha. Probably true but i also like the challenge of getting the best of what i can get and not spend every cent i have trying to do it.

[Shakotan_Aaron]

perhaps with a conservative rev limit and mild boost levels then one of these larger capacity bottom ends maybe a bit more reasonable? try and tune it for responce and toque.

[Joshstix]

i cannot workout why aussies continually insist on using shit bottom ends just to gain a few extra cc's.

perhaps in a daily it would make some sense but in a performance app for i dont see it.

5s botton end with 3s head, just like the corolla guys, 7afe bottom end with a 4ag head. plus the 7a crank is only 6bolt vs 8bolt.

id rather have the original shorter stroke (more rev happy) and a bottom end that will take a thrashing.

if you look to the jap companies, when they stroke a motor they do it properly. they use stroker cranks and rods, not steal junk gear from junk motors

just my 2c

Maybe if you weren't talking out of your arse you'd be able to see what actually works. Take a look around at the big power 3S's being used in a situation that isn't full race and they will pretty much all be running 5S cranks. A hell of a lot of the big power MR2's that have come out of Japan with stroker motors had 5S cranks in them with aftermarket rods.

Here's an example of a 5S crank in a 3S block, doesn't look too poor to me.

[imgwrong link/img]

Don't think it's some kind of Australia thing using hte 5S crank. It's a common sense thing when they have been tested in hundreds of setups at engine speeds up to and over 9000rpm and have been shown to be reliable and produce more power under the curve than stock stroke.

Here's an example of one of those low boost low rev daily drivers you were talking about



Well it's a daily driver at least but not really low boost or revs I guess.

Comparing using a 5S crank in a big power 3S to using a 7A crank in a big power A series motor is an absolute joke. The 7A crank is fairly weak and has been demonstrated to be so. The 5S crank and block are both stronger than the 3S parts. If you'd rather have an engine that is less reliable and makes less usable power then that's your choice.

When specialists who build these motors day in day out for a living suggest that the best and strongest combination is a 98+ 5S block with a 5S crank and aftermarket 3S journal rods I think there might be something to it.

[ae85 trueno]

Thats a nice looking crank but you sure its a 5sfe.
Might be a aftermarket 1 which would be good to have but i think we were talkin more about the 2.2 5sfe celica type crank.
The only 5sfe ( out of 2.2 Celica) i know has a gear for the balance shaft as part of it
were as that 1 looks identical to gen2 crank in the picture above

[Shakotan_Aaron]

that list includes "ATS stroker" so its most probaly not a factory bottom end/crank.

[Joshstix]

that list includes "ATS stroker" so its most probaly not a factory bottom end/crank.

This is what I mean about talking out of your arse. ATS is the company that built it yes and Aaron the owner of the car is the owner of the company. They build a shed load of 3S strokers and they are all based on a 5S crank shaft.

A little bit of research rather than just making statements based on assumption would be a handy thing. People spreading misinformation based off assumptions and something they heard of a bloke one time down the pub is a pet peev of mine.

[Joshstix]

Thats a nice looking crank but you sure its a 5sfe.
Might be a aftermarket 1 which would be good to have but i think we were talkin more about the 2.2 5sfe celica type crank.
The only 5sfe ( out of 2.2 Celica) i know has a gear for the balance shaft as part of it
were as that 1 looks identical to gen2 crank in the picture above

Yep that one was my mistake, that was the wrong picture, the dude putting it together was putting it together as a budget setup from bit's lying around instead of building a stroker like he does for the majority of his customers. It's actually a Gen3 crank in that picture.

There is no reason that the balance shaft gear needs to stay when using the crank in a 3S. Sure it adds a bit of cost but not a heap.

Mind you the reason why people use the 5S crank rather than getting a custom one turned up, other than the fact they are plenty durable enough, is that you can build a full on long block stroker with a 5S crank for the price of a billet crank. That built long motor will make a hell of a lot more power for the money than a custom crank will. Bottom end bits might sound cool to the V8 bogan brigade but they don't make power so there is no point spending money on them if cheaper bits are durable in the chosen installation.

[50RTD]

I, like many folk, am actually more interested in the 5s block strength than the extra capacity, however that's certainly a bonus.
Thank you to those who answered my questions!