3sgte Limits???

[piggy]

from what i have read over the years the gen 1 3s have the strongest block out of the lot, they also use a single entry ct26 (unlike the gen2 wich use a twin enty ct26) and aftermarket support is zero for the gen 1's, they are limited due to the fact that standard they are air flow meter only while the the gen 2 use bother airflow meter and a mapsensor , the gen2 is suppose to have the best flowing head and there is a little aftermarket support for these badboys, gen 3 is where they started to become cool running a map sensor only, also running a ct20b turbo which is by far a better turbo and there is a fair bit of aftermarket support for these guys and they are becoming cheaper.

[Cuts]

185 have bigger ports so technically they would flow more, but they actually flow too much and hurts power.

gen 3 and up use shim under bucket cam actuation and also have 3 angle cut stainless steel valves factory.

the map sensor on the gen2 does nothing for the tuning side of things appart from as a reference for boost cut.

dizzy was ditched for gen4, gen3 are still dizzy.

[jonathan yee]

the gen1 has the least of all aftermarket support. also i believe the gen1's dont have oilsquirters tho i think people use the 5S blocks without squirters and it's not a problem.

gen1 heads have the bad tvis design like gen2's (ok for low HP better low torque response than gen3's) but the cams from gen2 on cant be used in the gen1 head.

lowest HP from factory. but it was the first and pretty damn good when it came out.

[piggy]

dizzy was ditched for gen4, gen3 are still dizzy.

cheers for the correction

[jwebb2876]

Whoops Holy old thread batman!

[50RTD]

Anyone got any good links to info on 5s/3s hybrids? Like what to use, what not to use etc?

I'd love to know more about the intricate differences between the two motors, such as:

-Can the 3s flywheel, clutch and box be used directly on the 5s crank?

-Which starter motor and alternator is used?

-3s head bolt on without modification? Same head gasket?


Etc etc.

[jonathan yee]

Anyone got any good links to info on 5s/3s hybrids? Like what to use, what not to use etc?

I'd love to know more about the intricate differences between the two motors, such as:

-Can the 3s flywheel, clutch and box be used directly on the 5s crank?

-Which starter motor and alternator is used?

-3s head bolt on without modification? Same head gasket?


Etc etc.

from memory you need to use the 5sfe flywheel, or i think fidanza make a flywheel to suit the 5s crank for use with a 3s clutch. guess it depends on whether you doin an NA or turbo hybrid as to what clutch you wanna use.

stater and alternators are the same.

head bolts on, but i think people do something with the water galleries.

[Roundy]

search www.mr2oc.com

HUGE amount of info there re. strokers.

I am looking to do a stroker myself, 5S crank, 3S block and head.

Rod journals need to be machined down.
need to get 'stroker' pistons with a higher pin height
Flywheel does need to be different, the PCD on the crank is ~1mm larger on the 5s

I have read that a 5s block needs some machining to fit an AWD box (if that matters)

I believe there is a certain age 5s block that will allow a 3s head to fit without modification, however i am unsure of what year it is.

[Cuts]

tristan at wtf auto would be the man to ask.

[jonathan yee]

tristan at wtf auto would be the man to ask.

what he said.

there are several ways to do the stroker. i think

1:use 5S block, the benefits are stronger wall between 2/3 cylinder but no oil squirters under pistons.

2:use 3s block 5s crank and puater rods which dont require machining down and removing precious metal on the rod journal, rods are expensive. and you need CP made pistons

3: use 3s block and 5s crank and machine rod jounals to suit 3s rods with 3s pistons but i think this means you dont get the full displacement increase

4:buy the HKS stroker kit, dunno how many vital organs you'd need to sell to afford this tho...?

[davidleonardi]

All, Happy New Year

I would under normal circumstances resist the urge to launder my filthy ignorance in public like this, but today I purchased Zoom magazine, Issue 108… Not normally a bad read…

This month includes an article regarding the 3SGTE, an engine I have always regarded as possibly some of the best engineering to come from Toyota (other than the 1/2JZ). I had high hopes of at some point building an engine that made a lot of power and was high revving (I was once told you could get an upgrade on the factory computer which would allow the ST185 rev to 8000 rpm so always believed a well built unit should be able to make 10,000 easily enough especially given some of the Beams offerings).

The article goes on to talk about WTF Auto, and all the big HP engines they have built, sounds like a genuine group with a lot of experience… They describe my precious 3SGTE (Gen II and III) as being limited to approximately 260RWKW by the non Siamese design of the two bores in the centre. The solution to this is apparently to use the 5SFE block (you also get an extra 200cc of displacement). If you have any interest in anything 3SGTE or 5SFE I highly recommend a read.

I did a little scratching around on the WWW and the only thing I was able to find was a couple of fairly general articles regarding Rod Millens Pikes Peak Celica which apparently made 800HP with a 3SGTE engine… It read to me like this may have been speculation rather than fact though…

I seek anyone who has pushed their 3SGTE project to the outer limits of what is reasonable, and didn’t crack bores or otherwise ruin their block and my dream…. Its one of those things when you are sure that you have read about one, but go find that article again???

If a thread of this nature exists please let me know. Otherwise, I look forward to your response.

Thanks and Regards,

JD

If I want to change with the 5sfe block, does the block will fit directly into the st185 engine ??
Do I need to change the stroker kits as well ? If it's a lot of mods should be done, I kinda of lazy of doing it.

Kindly advice. Thanks.

[ae85 trueno]

We are using a 5sfe crank in our stroker engine and was wonder what sort of power and revs most people think these cranks will take before destroying themselves NA or Turbo

What sort of mods are being done to them to make them at least half decent because they are very ordinary compared to just about any 3sge cranks.

[riderzx10r]

I don't know much about these engines but it seems you guys do. thought you might be interested in this....

777hp 3sgte ae86

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wB2hVXchxCk

[jonathan yee]

We are using a 5sfe crank in our stroker engine and was wonder what sort of power and revs most people think these cranks will take before destroying themselves NA or Turbo

What sort of mods are being done to them to make them at least half decent because they are very ordinary compared to just about any 3sge cranks.

i think tristans had exp with 5S stroked 3s's and he's pulled it too 8000rpm.

we need two of him. one to answer all our questions and another to do the work.

[Roundy]

No reason it shouldn't rev to 8k with suitable Cams etc etc.

I have never read anything that says the 5s crank is ordinary? What way do you mean?