1st GEN Celica Surge Tank Ideas

[takai]

ca celica, that is exactly the setup these guys are trying to avoid. No matter how good the installation, there will always be some vapour bleeding through the rubber hoses. All steel lines would eliminate the fuel vapour, but would make it much harder for the average backyarder to install.

My feeling, is that the space between the spare tyre well, and the jack well (under the car)could be utilized for the surge tank. Think outside the square, the surge tank does NOT have to be a vertical cannister. You could even gravity feed the surge tank, by cleverly installing the pick up in the existing fuel tank drain.

cheerrs Chuck.

Interestingly since i have sealed over the panel covering my surge tank in the spare tyre well i havnt had any smells or odours since...

[DQIKST]

nath,

go and see MR ENFORCER,

i went to him the other week and he is going to mount the surge tank under the car and infront of the diff, ( i.e front meaning engine side not boot side, )

he showed me how he done a set up on a RX7, and this means no horrible fuel smell, no major problems if some one hits you, and it will be away from boot mounted battery,

he is going to charge me 180-200 bucks for the tank, dont know what it is for labour,

but the problem is that you have already brought your surge tank

DQIKST

[lt1972]

Just a thought....
How much fuel pumping through an engine bay atm?
In RUBBER hoses to boot.
hence....
I dont think you have to be too worried about having a stainless steel/ alloy surge tank sitting in your engine bay
seen it in a ta22 w/ quads and will do the same setup w/ mine. looked tidy too.

[takai]

In case of fire though you have a nice big resevoir of fuel in the engine bay.... NOT pretty.

[Dangerous Dave]

i went to him the other week and he is going to mount the surge tank under the car and infront of the diff, ( i.e front meaning engine side not boot side, )

This sounds good. When are you getting it done? Once done can you please post pics up?

Thanks

David

[DQIKST]

hopefully in the early weeks of next month,

will post piks too, keep eye out 4 members ride thread

[DQIKST]

any one going to throw up some more pictures of fuel set ups for the RA23???

[TA-022]

same shit but right side ... run lines through floor to pumps etc.

your making me look bad DQ

[TheToyman75]

Ibz,

Here are the only pics I have of the surge tank and pump in the TA22, Unfortunatly Idon't have anythat show the mounting base or the copper lines that go through the floor panel to the main pump. I would do the feed to the main pump a little differently if I was to do it again tho.

This pic shows the carter black lift pump mounted the back of the rear seat bracing and its prefilter. As you can see the tank has had a new pic up and return line fitted so the liftpump can be fed via a 5/16 line which then feeds the surge tank of course. The main pump is gravity fed below the surge tank (see second pic)

[TheToyman75]

The RA28 surge tank concept is very similar to Stews.

The Surge tanks and pumps are mounted where the stock rear muffler would reside. The first step was to fit the mounts for the surge tank and pump assembly. Of course you can mount them all seperatly but I wanted it as neat as possible and a stone guard for behind the tyre.

I made a template out of cardboard for the base plate and had Linden at Road runner make the base plate for me. Then I drilled the holes in the base plate and the floor of the RA28 atthe same time so they would line up perfectly. This also mean the pumps and surge tank could be mounted without getting in the way of the mounting points.

I used nutserts to fit the cotton real mounts (The rubber isolators) but you can just as easily use a nut and washer as you are montingthem in the jack and tool compartment.

Here are the isolators and then the fitted base plate.





You can see the orange paint pen has the location for the surge tank and pumps etc marked out for linden to position for me.

Then the completed set up:


And fitted under the car:


And the stone Guard:


I have since replaced the banjo bolt with a one way valve and cap nut into the end of the main pump to make for a much nicer start.

[worldwalker]

So did anyone try an EFI tank idea? as stated in other threads my tank is a little dead and I'd like to replace it, if I can avoid dicking around with a surge tank and excess pumps that'd make life a lot easier.

edit:
My question on the whole surge tank set ups etc, if they're so vital as apposed to replacing the tank with an EFI tank, how come cars like civic's and integra's with small flat tanks which are running "street" turbo set ups dont have them?? I would have thought that a 1.8lt or 2lt 4 cyl running 9-14psi would requir as much fuel as a 1GGTE on similar psi?

Probably a stupid question.

EDIT EDIT:
Just read de wiltz thread and its all making sence.

[Major Clod]

OK, I've been reading through a whole lot of threads lately on EFI setups, and I've got an idea or two for my RA23. I've gotten the idea for this from another thread in the forums, I'm just trying to put it into context for my RA23.

Now my idea is for an intank surge/efi setup.



Ok, that is the RA23 tank. What I have is a spare 91 Magna fuel tank/efi pickup, which is as close to upright as you'll get these days. We were simply going to cut out the mounting section of the EFI pickup, and graft it to the top of the RA23 tank in place of the original pickup. The bracket holding the EFI pump simply needs to be extended approx 5cm to be nice and low.

Now while there is a big hole in the top of the fuel tank, I was looking at mounting a cylinder inside to surround the pump. Unlike a baffle with holes etc, this baffle will be supplied fuel by a small intank lifter pump (apparently the VL commode has quite a small intank lifter) The top of this cylinder will be open so the pump can be removed, maybe with a small lip, or a lid welded to the underside of the pickup to minimalise spillage.

Now theoretically, this cylinder will always remain full regardless of the level of the tank, as the lifter will be constantly filling it up. The magna pump looks like it can be easily replaced with a universal walbro etc, no issues there.

I know it seems like a bit of a stuff around compared to an external setup, but my father is a diesel mechanic, who has access to all of the tools to do this in his shed, and has welded dozens and dozens of fuel tanks in his lifetime, so cost of labour isn't a problem, and I already have access to the Magna tank/pickup.

I'd really just like to avoid the external setup, with hoses/wires/smells running throughout my boot and under the car. The car itself is mainly for street, with possibly the odd track day here and there for fun, nothing too serious. Engine is an 18RGEU, however that will change eventually.

I've test fitted this all up with my spare tank, so its all possible, mainly looking for flaws in design I guess...

[Gold28]

Looks fine to me and is basically the same as putting an external surge tank inside the main tank, just make sure both pumps are designed to be submerged and that the lift pump has sufficient flow to keep the surge tank full.

This is a good solution for a 23 as the tank sits upright, it wouldn't work as well on the 28's and early 22's as the tanks are flat.

[airfireman1]

Ok, I have a couple of questions and ideas for the RA28 setup, USA version RA late series had an in tank fuelpump. I have one of these being posted here in the next couple of weeks, This being a direct swap with the origional sender unit then all that would be required is a swirl pot and efi pump. That would make it a more compact solution and require less modification.
I have yet to find out how baffled the origional USA fuel tank is but if it is, then it is feasable to have a complete EFI intank setup using that style tank or just adding a suitable baffle system with a bit of cutting and welding. Then no requirement for swirl pots and extra pumps and hoses .
The 18RG is getting the EFI treatment at the moment so if it all works I will keep you up to date.

[worldwalker]

I'd be interested in this pump, from what a lot of other guys of said you can just get away with keeping lots of fuel in the tank, could be a problem and a risk to your engine. How much were you paying for the pump?