Toyota electronic speedos: feed signal?

[wagonist]

I'm not sure what you mean.

The speed sensor for the Excel is inside the cluster because it's cable driven from the box
The speed signal for the Elantra is a sensor on the box (where the cable would fit).

These are interchangable between the boxes. ie, I currently have the Elantra box fitted to the Excel engine with the Excel mech cable coming off the box.
I am aiming to fit the Elantra engine at some point once I sort out the wiring. But figuring this out is one of the wiring issues.

[masterofsinanju]

Wagonist, give CAE performance in Melbourne a call. Sounds like an inline hall effect sensor is what you are after. They did a custom cable and sensor (but reed switch type with two wires) to fit factory ta23 speedo and w57 box for under $250. Should be bolt in once I get around to the dash, but it all looks good. You don't need the custom cable but it's a little shorter to fit the sensor.

They were able to give me a bit of advice on the sensor I needed.

Seems like a lot less faffing about than trying to mount a hyundai cluster.

[wagonist]

So to summarise:
the current problem is that the Excel would use a reed switch inside the cluster to feed its ECU
but the Elantra uses a Hall Effect sensor to feed the signals
And these signals cannot be converted from one to another?

yes signal output from speedo is normally a reed switch to ground
frequency and amplitude isnt an issue
main thing is if the pull up resistor is inside speedo or inside speed sensor
toyota speed sensors have it in side them
holden speedometer have it inside them
so if it doesnt work then fit a pullup resistor from signal to 12v

So if the frequency & amplitude aren't an issue, why would it be a problem to use a Toyota speedo like you originally said would be pointless?

I still want to modify the cluster so the tacho is in the middle, and there's no other space for a speedo. most Excel clusters don't have a tacho, so they have a large speedo in the middle, water temp on the left & fuel on the right. To fit the tacho, they moved the water temp and fuel together on the right & installed a smallish tacho on the left. I might yet even ditch the standard cluster & just custom make something myself to mount the gauges as I prob should get oil pressure & temp, plus possibly boost gauges in the future.

I only picked Toyota speedos as an example because some cars were running them from the early 90s & are simple to wire up with power, earth & signal, and therefore, can be removed from the cluster and mounted elsewhere with the correct wiring.
Hyundai only went from cable speedos about 11 years ago, and then went straight to digital odometers & therefore full circuit boards with chips & stuff.

I'm more concerned about the ECU getting the correct signal.
If I really have to, and whatever speedo I choose is the wrong scale, I've got CAD skills and a cousin who does custom graphics, so I can redo the speedo face to match.

[masterofsinanju]

Wagonist, because I have a one track mind, what car are you converting? I ask because in my ta23 at least it looks like I could swap the tacho and the speedo in the same dash with minimal fuss.

[wagonist]

I'm converting a Hyundai Excel. It's getting a 2L VVT Hyundai Elantra engine.

This was the original cluster:
http://www.southportautorecyclers.co...225387_kms.jpg

Which I then converted to this:
http://ebay.roadtestedspares.com.au/V5801/14.jpg

One of the wrecks I bought came with a largish aftermarket tacho screwed to the dash, so I would like to put that where the speedo is.

[masterofsinanju]

ok, that makes it much clearer.

So it's still a mechanical signal to the speedo and then electronic to the ecu? So inline sensor would work. Doesn't matter if it is reed or hall effect if it takes the signal from a mechanical input.
Issue remaining is how to swap tacho for speedo?

[wagonist]

Yes, for the Excel.

But I'm going to be using the factory Elantra ECU which uses an electronic sender on the box (a Hall sensor with 3 wires) & then an electronic Speedo.
But like I've said in a previous post, Hyundai jumped a couple stages of development when they went from the Lantra to the Elantra & from the first model Accent (which was pretty much just an Excel with a different bodyshell) to the 2nd model Accent. Where they went from mech speedo & odo to LCD odo & electronic speedo.

Tacho I can sort out. It'll mean butchering a cluster, but it's not like they're hard to find...

I went to a place today that can sell me a Hall effect sender that should screw into the gearbox, and then the cable into that. As long as the Koreans adopted the Japanese standardised spec for gearbox speedo senders.
And they can measure the signal coming out of the factory Elantra one to see if we've got a match or not.
Around $100. and means I can keep my current cluster setup if I want and change it later.

[masterofsinanju]

Nice work. Sorry I couldn;t really help, but the problem was interesting.

I've heard that yundai (at least the earlier ones) used pretty much mitsubishi engines. Hopefully they followed the same lines re gearbox etc.

[wagonist]

Pre 95 Excel & Lantra were Mitsubishi copies. When the engine & gearbox got turned around in the bay on the Lancer is the same time that Hyundai started to make their own designed engines (so the first "bubble" shaped Excel & Lantra).
Though there must be some parts still carried over.
I'm using a Mitsubishi LSD & by using the Elantra steering knuckles, I can fit Evo brakes with no other mods.
Found out 2 weeks ago that the rear drum backing plates for the Excel have the same bolt holes as the Mirage.

Thanks for the input. I've found that by sounding out a problem, someone else's input can trigger thoughts & approaches.