280rwkw smallport 4age turbo setup?

[trdee]

if the ECU is limiting to 22psi, then the rest of the motor needs to be doen for 9500-10,000rpm.. on boost...

might be cheaper in the end to get a new ECU, run more boost at a lower rpm, and nto grenade it?

This man speaketh the truth. When you want to make this kind of power, then limiting your capabilities by using a low end ecu is not doing you any favours.

To get the power you want on only 22psi will mean shitloads of revs. The consensus here seems to be around 9000-9500rpm. To make this kinda power reliably on a 4A you need to have a SERIOUS look at the oil system, as well as strengthening the bottom end far beyond stock. It is simpler in many ways to run more boost at less revs, than less boost with more revs.

In summary, get a better ecu

[Cuzzo]

280kw isnt out of reach.

Big Power and Reliable is hard to fit in the same sentenace.

Gt30 minimum. 8500 rev limit. 25psi + and while your at it may aswell go e85 on a haltech or motec.

id hazard to say you can get this on a stockish bottom end. Pistons and rods with arp rod bolts, head studs and a good gasket.

[Bazda]

Easy answer.
4agze bottom end 8.9:1 compression, 20v blacktop head stock form. GT3076R+, 22psi, you will see around the 250-270kw mark on 98 pump gas.
Change to alcohol based fuels and you will see more powerz.

Will be a little laggy and you will need to rev it to around 8500rpm.
Go with a 7A the power band will shift down and you will only need to rev it to 8k. You would only need 18-20psi of boost to get the power above.

[Casey-G]

The ECU ISNT* limiting boost to 22PSI!

that is the limit of the internal map sensor.

If you buy a 3 or 4 bar sensor then you can run 40psi.


I reckon you should utilize the dual map mode haltech has to offer with even the sprint500 and have a map for c/q16 fuel and one for 98.


Your limitations are not with the ecu, i assure you.

[Bazda]

The tuner is also your limitation lol

[trdee]

true^ either way limiting your boost to 22psi is not ideal.

[Cuzzo]

The tuner is also your limitation lol

He is?

[Shifty]

I'm aware of the MAP sensing limitations of the Haltech, hence my comment. I can add an external MAP sensor, but 22psi is conveniently getting toward the safe limit of boost on pump fuel so it is a convenient 'limit'. Also you can still run 22psi+, you just can't map it specifically. Native boost limit aside the PS500 is a very competent ECU, I have the PS1000 in my current car and apart from the 22psi limit (which I don't mind) and it does everything I want. Boost levels above 22psi tend to suggest you are starting to push the limits of your turbo. As Bazda mentioned, the tune is a critical component in any setup too!

I'm putting in the stock 100kw jobbie shortly, and from comments above looks like I'm better off sneaking around to piece together a 7A/BT combo on the side. If someone in or around Brisbane has a 4A of say 250hp atw or more, I'd be interested to go for a run in it as long as you're a sensible driver (don't have to impress me, I just want to know how it drives, what response is like, etc).

[Casey-G]

In all seriousness dude, if you want that much oomph, 22psi is pretty much childs play, stock bottom ends will take the abuse of 30psi if balanced right, like those chaps over in NZ running 32odd psi on stock bottom ends with more or less standard BT20valve heads..


You just need to be realistic enough when it comes to smaller capacity engines and power thats matching fairly hot I6 engines. 500hp on say 16psi with 3liters will require almost double (not doing math this late) the manifold pressure to see the same power (obvisouly without revving the ring out of it).

The only difference between a sprint and a sport on the haltech range is tuning resolution, few extra AUX ports, and a couple of extra features... you could get 3bar external sensor and you'd be set. I guess what im trying to work out is why you think only 22psi is enough for your set goal/think its getting on the limitations?

[oldcorollas]

as he said, pump fuel

so the choices are:
E85 + more boost,
9500ish rpm,
more capacity,
revise peak power down....

any others?

Shifty, a 200kw atw 4A will be totally different to a 280kw atw 4A...

[trdee]

Why does pump fuel come into play at 22psi? Boost is only one factor in the detonation equation, if you're building the engine from the ground up like the OP is wanting to do then your dynamic compression ratio could be altered to run as much boost as you want.... within reason. An 8:1CR (stock bigport GZE) should see 25psi without much trouble on pump fuel assuming everything else is up to scratch.

I mean if you were building the car to a class of racing with specific limits on boost then fair enough, but limiting the boost to 22psi just cos it's too hard to run low comp pistons and a 4 bar map doesnt make sense to me, especially when the alternative means having to build a 4A capable of revving to 9500rpm

[Shifty]

as he said, pump fuel

so the choices are:
E85 + more boost,
9500ish rpm,
more capacity,
revise peak power down....

any others?

Shifty, a 200kw atw 4A will be totally different to a 280kw atw 4A...

E85 is a non-option. You just can't get it here & buying by the barrell is ridiculous for a street car.
I'd have thought a fairly standard 4A would go 9000-9500rpm without too much non-standard gear.
7A bottom end is an option, as is shelving the 4A idea for something larger.
Revising power level down is an option also... but until I can go for a run in a half-decent 4A it's hard to say.
200kw & 280kw definitely different, but a run in something ~200kw will give me a good guide on if I reckon it will be rubbish at 260-280kw.

As for other comments, detonation is the problem not boost level. Boost level is just one of a number of factors but if you can knock the top few % off each of the factors then you end up with a very reliable setup. Cam timing & selection is probably the single most important factor in my opinion...

[Cuzzo]

200kw is fun...... depending on what the car will weigh in the end.

[mr2mark]

E85 is a non-option. You just can't get it here & buying by the barrell is ridiculous for a street car.

You can buy e85 at a few pumps in qld but ethanol can range from 70-85% as I remember. As the octane rating will change with ethanol% I dont think thats suitable to tune on (without a expensive and/or tedious way of taking it into account anyway)

[trdee]

flex fuel sender...