2 pac clear over acrylic

[timbosaurus]

From my experience in the backyard, i agree with both 1JZ and Wagon.

The job i did on my '28 was with straight red acrylic tinter, no metallic or pearl. Upon recommendation from the paint shop, I didn't use a clear. He said buffing back the colour properly would not be ANY different to spraying a clear over the top and buffing that. The only time that u need clear with acrylic is when you use metallic or pearl etc.

The paint on mine looked dull and boring for a couple of weeks until i fine-sanded, cut and buffed it, then it came up superbly in most places! Unfortunately i learnt that 4-5 coats of colour is not enough, and I couldn't buff it enough to make the whole car beautiful So i'm left with a half buffed finish because i dont wanna buff through to the undercoat. That is the only thing i would change about the way i did that car.

Next job will be 2pak though, because buffing the whole car was a pain in the butt, and there are some spots you just cant get shiny (engine bay etc). So I will experiment with 2pak and hopefully enjoy the benifit of gloss off the gun!

Personally i wouldn't mix paints, if i've setup for 2k clear, i'd use 2k base and prep. Otherwise i'd just keep everything acrylic. Not saying it's not right or can't be done... just that i would either choose one way or another. I have heard that the majority of show paint jobs are acrylic because of it's finish... but that's just a rumour i heard. resurecting a rusted wreck to look decent again was by far the most frustrating thing i've done in a while... but now it's done, i think it was also the most rewarding. If you want a good job done well, quickly and accountably, take it to a pro... but if you have the time and patience, have ago yourself. Just don't expect too much, that can only lead to disappointment.

[kremsra28]

ok guys, as said above, you shouldn really mix the 2 types of paint but it is possible when done right. you should NEVER put 2pak over acrylic, as also said above, acrylic cures by losing and evapourating solvents, ie, thinners. this process can take months, even upto a yr, putting 2pak clear over the top will trap these solvents in as it sets hard, when all the solvent are trapped they keep trying to get out and it will eventually lead to crows feet and humidity blister looking paint, therfore the need to strip it all and paint it again!!
you can put acrylic over 2pak witout any probs but NEVER go the other way!!

there is absolutely nothing wrong wit acrylic paint ecxept the extra work to get it looking good and of course the shrink back that occurs. as one of the guys said above, put plenty of clear on and face it off wit 1500-2000 wet to get the peel off, a good way to do this is to start rubbin, usin heaps of water and put some car wash detergent in the water to help stop the paper from loading up, a nice soft flexy rub pad should also be used, if you are not sure how nuch clear you have taken off simply dry the area wit a old chamois and you will see little shiny dimples in the paint, if a fully smooth and peel-les look is wat you want keep repeating this process until the area is totaly dull before you buff it, if you are buffing under flouro lights or in a dim area dont be too concerned bout and fine scratches in the paint after you have buffed it, this will always occur using acrylic paint systems, you wont be able to see them in daylight!!

when painting wit acrylic NEVER try to get a glossy and shiny finish off the gun, as you will be dissapointed, when painting the clear, start wit the 1st coat mixed as reccomended, then next coat add 15% more thinners, then 15%more wit next coat until you end up wit 1part clear to around 3parts thinners, this wit using a little more air pressure than reccomended will gice you less peel to face off prior to buffing, saving you a few hrs and also your arm from dropping off!!

i would confront the guy at the paint shop and ask him why he told you that you could use 2pak clear over your acrylic as it would have stuffed your job, ask to see the manager and tell him/her as it could have cost you alot of money and time if you had of taken his advice

a good clear to use is the 1 some1 said above, protec have great products and from memory its around $70 for 4ltrs

all the best and if you have already finished your job then i hope my advice will help some1 else and CLEAR up a few thigs that was said above

krem

[Major Clod]

Another awesome way I've just been playing with, to remove clearcoat peel I've been using the 3M P1200 and P1500 finishing discs on my dual action sander.

I found, when doing the car by hand, I noticed that I'd occasionally get some scratches as i was sanding. Little particles get caught up and give a little scratch which is a bit too deep to be taken out with compound. Now I was sanding the car with constant flowing, soapy water but it still occurred.

I checked out these 3M discs and they work brilliantly. Not only do they leave less scratches, I can sand a whole panel in 15 minutes, when it would take me close to an hour to flatten the bugger by hand. I generally do a light pass over the panel once, then rub off any dust with a cotton towel and do the same to the disc. Repeat and repeat and finish with the 1500, and you shouldn't get any deep scratches.

I then hit the sanded panel with Meguiars Diamond Cut compound and a Meguiars wool pad, and the finish comes up like a mirror, their compounds are awesome and break down as you go. Then used some Meguiars Speed Glaze using my random orbital sander, a foam polishing pad, and a slow speed, and it polishes out any swirl marks and holograms from the wool pad.

["Z" UTE]

I have painted a few cars, some with acrylic, some with enamel, and some with 2PAK. There are some really lousy paint types out there, stuff that will not not gloss up, clears that have to be reduced by 20 times their volume just to spray them.

I have been using PPG paint products for quite a few years now.

Their COBRA, is a clear over base system. The clear is 2PAK, and the basecoat is a step up from acrylic. If anyone has doubts about the shine, have a look at the blue 1JZ-GTE powered RA23 Celica in the current issue of ZOOM.

cheers Chuck.

[ae86trueno]

Get your engine bay looking this good with acrylic



done using 620 Barracryl ICF in the backyard on the weekend !!

Ben.

[kremsra28]

Get your engine bay looking this good with acrylic



done using 620 Barracryl ICF in the backyard on the weekend !!

Ben.

it is possible, but its not as easy as it is doin it wit 2pak, 2pak is the best and easiest to use, there is no doubt in that, but some ppl dont have the equipment or know how to use it, its best to start wit acrylic to get the hang of how the gun works wit different tips and air pressure, how to mix the paint up to acheice more or less peel, how to paint pearls and mettalic finishes witout striping etc, i have only painted a few cars, none of which have been a solid colour, the 3rd car i painted was my rx7 which was a 3layer pearl job in which i was quoted 12k for, took it back after it was finished and they told me that it wasnt painted wit acrylic, you can get the look of 2pak wit acrylic, but not the durability.if ican figure out how to put pics up of the car i would but me not real clever wit computers

my best advice is to find some1 that is a proffesional and to pick their brain and to read a few books over and over, then buy a intermediate gravity feed gun wit 2 tips for around $170 and try doing a few small parts, ecen a piece of mdf or somethin!! thats how i learnt but i was fortunate to have a good mate the was a panel beater show me how to straiten stuff and another good mate (a painter of 10yrs) to show me the basics wit the gun, if i stuffed somethin up i would call them and ask for advice. now i can do nearly any type of repair and paint anything, it saves heaps of money!!

krem

[rokusan]

http://www.freeimagehosting.netyou can upload pics off your PC here, and then copy "most forums' and paste in here

[EldarO]

Cant paint 2pac over acrylic that hasnt full cured.

cant paint acrylic over 2pac, otherwise you get a crows feet/orange peel effect, that looks like dogs balls.

ill post pictures if need be, just let me know before tomorrow

Eldar.O.

[lumpy]

Get your engine bay looking this good with acrylic



done using 620 Barracryl ICF in the backyard on the weekend !!

Ben.

But that is acrylic .


Isocyante free 2k paints are actually acrylic chemistry rather than urethane or epoxy They are almost as good as the urethane but not quite as hard/chemically resistant. Most of the 2K isocyanate free is used in industrial applications or things like mine sites where they are painting large structures outside (hence can't use isocyanates). Not that popular with auto as there 2k urethane is used in spray booths etc.

Another good reason for 2k products instead of acrylic is chemical resistance. In an engine bay with oil, petrol, heat and other things a 2k will always perform better than a single pack acrylic.

[EldarO]

you can put acrylic over 2pak witout any probs but NEVER go the other way!!
krem

no, beleive me, you cant, i have tried, and every time, ive had shit come up, i then went back over, and sanded everything back, and resprayed, eveen then, the bits that hadnt been sanded well enough showed the same cracking.

third time lucky, i managed to get a decent finish all over.

the 2Pak i was spraying over was dont off an air compressor, mixed properly, the acrylic i used came straight from the spray can.

Eldar.O.

[Grega]

2pak will go over acrylic in a "repair" situation - ask dint doctors and spray painters.
it will eventually craze though where the two paints are blended (in time this will happen) but by then you probably won't own the car.

i won't personally spray 2pak due to the isocyanate content ; and ; its illegal to spray outside a controlled environment - the EPA will fine you big time for it.

i've had really good results from spraying acrylic in the past and will continue to do so in the future. one thing i found which helped bring up the gloss in the clear was post spraying my last clear coat ; hit the job with a "wet" coat of thinner ; this helps settle the clear but also gives you a very nice clean finish.

hope this helps

[ae86trueno]

But that is acrylic

Yes lumpy according to the info sheet, the Barrcryl ICF is a 2 Pack Acid Catalysed Epoxy Arcylic,
But having said that this i prefer the 2 pack acrylic to the normal.

Ben.

[lumpy]

Yes lumpy according to the info sheet, the Barrcryl ICF is a 2 Pack Acid Catalysed Epoxy Arcylic,
But having said that this i prefer the 2 pack acrylic to the normal.

Ben.

Yeah I know dude I was just kinda taking the piss because I work in the paint manufacturing industry . 2k will always give much better dry film performance than a conventional solution acrylic. Acid Cat products are used a lot in the furniture/fixtures industry.