Ignition maps - show us yours

[stradlater]

Wow, that seems all over the place, or is it just me?

[privatealpha]

Could someone please post up a 4agte ignition map.

[oldeskewltoy]

this was posted on C4AG.... - Basic 16V 4A-GE



there's also a pdf some where in the net (http://www.ae86.hu/download/8/) by Jeremy Ross who analyzed the MR2 4age ecu and it's ignition table

[chris_rg]

has anybody seen a 1g-gte ignition map?

[Casey-G]

Subscribing, i have a 4agze and a 4agte, installing and tuning both myself by a road tune and eventually a dyno to get those hard to reach spots... Still new at it but im enjoying it. will get a couple of screen shots up soon.

[oldeskewltoy]

adding another from over @ club4ag

ok here its mine on a boosted smallport 4ag using vp 100 octane.

[Tjay]

why no 18rg maps?

[ballpencil]

Would love to have some input on my 4A-GE 16V Turbo map with 4A-GZE pistons.
I'm running 92 Octane.

The boost region on high RPMs could use a bit more advance, no?
This is "dyno-tuned" map, only i'm not sure if the tuner is experienced enough. I feel like it's a bit conservative.

[PrettyCoolWagon]

Great thread.
As a noob, the graphs can look quite different. (and obviously the opinions are sometimes different too)
How does one begin to learn how to read fuel and ignition maps?

[jondee86]

How does one begin to learn how to read fuel and ignition maps?

The maps are quite straight forward. Each map has a vertical axis representing engine load in percentage of Throttle Position Sensor (TPS) opening, or Manifold Absolute Pressure (MAP) in kPa. The horizontal axis represents engine speed in RPM. As with all maps or graphs, each point on the map can be identified by reading horizontally and vertically, and noting the corresponding values on each axis.

Thus, it is possible to find the ignition timing or injector opening time at a certain rpm and MAP, by locating the value that lies at the intersection of the axes. In the case of an ignition map, the value will be in crankshaft degrees before top dead centre (BTDC). A fuel map value will usually be the injector open time in milliseconds, although some maps will convert this reading to a Volumetric Efficiency (VE) for ease of tuning.

The engine computer uses the values programmed into these maps, together with its reading of the MAP, TPS and RPM sensors, to determine how much fuel to deliver, and how much to adjust the spark timing. Having control of the programming allows the car owner or tuner to add or subtract fuel and timing from any point (cell) on the map, to improve the engines performance.

That's about it in simplified form. Having a read of the user's manual for just about any aftermarket engine computer will give you a lot more in depth information.

Cheers... jondee86

[PrettyCoolWagon]

Excellent answer Jondee - Makes a good start for beginners like myself.
Pos rep 4 U dude!
much appreciated.

[andrew_mx83]

hey guys im keen to map out my stock ignition curve to see if it is still suitable for my purposes or if i need to go programmable.

setup is a 7m-ge on dedicated LPG (carb), stock ecu still running spark. no AFM or injectors.

what i really want to know is if there is any load compensation still -not sure if this is TPS or AFM based on a stock ecu. i am concerned that its just running a "limp home" type map that is only advancing timing linearly according to engine speed.



any suggestions on how to map it?
my thoughts were to mark the front timing cover around to say 50 deg and run the engine at set RPMs, noting what the timing light says for each. i can then plug in a dummy TPS and AFM, trick the computer into thinking they are x% open and seeing what effect it has on the timing. luckily my engine will still run without either of these connected!
if i record all these results i should be able to produce a graph similar to above (i think)

[jondee86]

I think you might have your work cut out to get quality information out. Without any load on the engine, the rpm will go high with very little airflow. And the ECU will be expecting certain correlations between AFM, TPS and rpm. So, while it is easy enough to work the RPM axis, working the AFM (load) axis will be difficult.

Not my speciality, but I would expect that if you hooked up the AFM to to the carb to give the ECU a load reading, it should control timing as usual. Worst comes to worst, you might have to plug in the TPS just to stop the ECU going into limp home mode.

Cheers... jondee86

[DX20VT]

You guys are pretty keen making judgement calls & providing advice (add timing etc) on other's ignition maps without knowledge of the particular engine & its supporting components.

Main thing I see here is no input from anyone on if the timing they are showing includes base timing or is on top of base timing,
as a lot of older style aftermarket ECU's always showed what the ECU was adding to base timing,
or does everyone always set base timing to 0 degress ??

I do quite a few mechanical dist's for race engine's through work, and most stuff it set to fire at 36 deg at full load,
as they was always where the expected power was.

[jondee86]

On the Adaptronic e420c there is a "timing lock" function that can be selected in the software. This sets the ECU to a fixed ignition timing, which again is selectable. Mine is set to 15 DBTDC = around idle timing. Then the CAS is adjusted so that the timing light shows the ignition firing at 15 DBTDC. Therefore, whatever the ignition map is showing, is what the engine is running at... no base timing to be added.

I imagine other aftermarket ECU's would be much the same, as setting base timing on the OEM ECU is effectively the same process as described above. A method of zeroing the ECU so that the calculated and actual timing are the same.

Cheers... jondee86