4AGE crank/rods

[Hiro]

Losing almost a full KG on the internals (and thats just counting the crank) makes a HUGE difference. I run 3rib NA with smaller internals, lightweight flywheel, etc., etc. Rev's extremely easily(and loses revs just as easy). If you plan on throwing the gearshift around alot i would definately recommend lightening as much in the engine as possible.

I cannot remember the exact ratio but losing weight in the engine compares to losing body weight at like 1:50.

Loosing weight on the crank is less important than weight in the rods and pistons. The further from the rotational centre the mass is, the bigger the difference. Lightened flywheels make sooooo much more difference, you take the same 700g saving from the crank and put take that from the outer rim of the flywheel instead, and you'll have a completely different engine. Thus, my comment about the crank alone not being that significant.

[oldeskewltoy]

Had the same ideas........

http://www.toymods.net/forums/showpo...1&postcount=49

I'm down almost 3 kilos just on the internals - comparing stock large rod journal crank and rods, pistons, and wrist pins.... to a custom lightened small rod journal crank, lightened rods, and lighter wrist pins(24 grams per was "found" in EACH wrist pins alone!)....

For pistons... you can start with the ones I chose - 4AGE from either Singapore, or EUG markets... those markets that didn't have catalyst, had 10 to 1 compression instead of 9.4... or you can go custom. The part number of the Toyota slug is in my link above....

[fixeruperer]

im down about 6kg (crank, rods and flywheel) and my motor doesnt idle under 1200rpm

[turbo4agte]

Doesn't lighter internals only produce faster revving/more response?

Im having a hard time understanding how going with a small journal crank will increase overall peak horsepower more than say 2-3%. They sell aftermarket Eagle style rods for the large journal crank which are as light as blacktop rods... also most aftermarket pistons are made for the large journal rod... as well as they are all lighter than the OEM pistons and pins. In general, Im just finding it alot easier to build a large journal block because of availabilty of parts and aftermarket support. Just my 2 cents.

[Dimitri]

i agree with above. unless you have some really specific goals, the later stuff seems to make more sense.

[Hiro]

Doesn't lighter internals only produce faster revving/more response?

They also allow higher rev limits, which with correct tuning can increase power. Putting lightened internals into an otherwise stock motor won't increase power, but it opens the door. Note how blacktop 20v internals are much lighter (particularly rods) to allows for that increase in revs.

[wombat]

Doing my research I've found they make more parts fro the later crank and blocks for a couple of reasons.
1, More of those engines available.
2, People tend to think bigger is better.
3. People are lazy and just throw a turbo on everything which means you need the bigger journal to handle the extra force put on it from the forced induction.
So basicly the supply to the bigger demand. Not enough people build engines NA because you actually have to use your brain to work it out and get power.

[fixeruperer]

ooooooo wah wah waaah hehe.
bustin your arse and your wallet for measly returns yeh n/a is awesome, n/a engines are cool when there over 3 liter under that they need 2 bar.

[merc-blue]

ooooooo wah wah waaah hehe.
bustin your arse and your wallet for measly returns yeh n/a is awesome, n/a engines are cool when there over 3 liter under that they need 2 bar.

uneducated..
The fastest car i have ever driven was a 2000cc NA did 1.29s around phillip island,
Infact i have driven a 250cc capable of 140s around phillip island

fastest V8 supercar time is 1.33

[fixeruperer]

when did time ever come into it ?
a quick/slow lap time has so many factors in achieving the outcome.

where talking about power.

[wombat]

Some people like throttle response and don't want to wait before they get to have some throttle response. lol

One thing I've learnt so far is you can have as big a power number as you want but that doesn't make it any good to drive. Torque is the real measure of an engine. and the usuable power band.

[turbo4agte]

Not enough people build engines NA because you actually have to use your brain to work it out and get power.

Thats one of the stupidest posts I've read on this board, and this forum is usually the best out of all that I visit as far as technical discussion.

First, all engines take skill to build and tune properly. Second, If someone wants to build a turbo engine, that doesn't mean their lazy, their free to do whatever they want with their own engine. And lastly, NA engines won't ever match the volumetric efficiency of a forced induction engine.

[merc-blue]

Thats one of the stupidest posts I've read on this board, and this forum is usually the best out of all that I visit as far as technical discussion.

First, all engines take skill to build and tune properly. Second, If someone wants to build a turbo engine, that doesn't mean their lazy, their free to do whatever they want with their own engine. And lastly, NA engines won't ever match the volumetric efficiency of a forced induction engine.

are you a idiot?... ofcoruse they wont match them... but that is why internationaly forced induction engines are pennalised some way.. i have done the math. it is my job to build race cars and i KNOW that my car will be faster with a NA

power is a crock. speed is everything.. i have driven 620+ HP race cars and they were less fun to drive than others.

NOW if your not contributing to my thread ON TOPIC. GTFO!!!!

I didnt mention anything about turbos.. because its not worthwhile.. i would rather spend 10K on a NA and have less power than spending 3K on a FI and having morepower. because the NA would be faster outright and be more compeditive in class..
CASE CLOSED GTFO (repeated for thoughts of little intelligence and missed it the first time!!)

[turbo4agte]

are you a idiot?...

No I'm not an idiot. I'm not trying to say which engine you should build or which I think is better. Because it really doesn't matter in regards to your post. I was just stating facts here and disputing that line regarding forced induction engines basically being easy to build, and the lazy way out.

And if you agree with that line there, your the idiot. I also doubt anyone who types and communicates thoughts like you do is as serious a racer or engine builder as you think you are.

[Billzilla]

ooooooo wah wah waaah hehe.
bustin your arse and your wallet for measly returns yeh n/a is awesome, n/a engines are cool when there over 3 liter under that they need 2 bar.

Pfft .....turbos are for people that can't build engines.
And BTW, it's spelt litres.