CV/Hub Issue

[Talasas]

Hey guys,

ever since I finished the turbo conversion and I put my front end back together, I've been getting this unbearably loud groaning, creaking sound coming from the front left when I turn.

To sum up the points:
- drive shafts were in good order before removal
- hubs were crappy but well greased and quiet before removal
- brakes were fine

What I have now:
- brakes still in good order
- hub or CV makes terrible noise
- inspection of hubs and CVs showed nothing visual, seems as it did before. I dismantled the hubs and looked, no signs of grinding anywhere, grease is healthy, no signs of overheating.

The suss stuff:
- drive shafts were hard to remove and put back in, required some minor "persuasion" - is this normal? I can't remember...
- happens when I turn right (> 50%) and at full lock left
- gets louder with power on and quieter with no load


Can anyone tell me what could this be? Have I done something wrong in re-assembly or have the hubs finally died in the ass?

[30psi 4agte]

Its not the backing plate rubbing on the disc?

I know you said it is a groaning noise but ..... if it sounds like a large clicking / cracking noise then the CV is rooted.

what is the wheel like to turn when the car is jacked up ? is siezed ---- or free turning?

[The Real Roadrunner]

the wheel bearings in these fail easily if over tensioned and sometimes you only hear it whilst turning. or have you left it slightly loose.
is there play in the hub or is it fine ie; when jacked up wobble the wheel to check for play in the bearing assy.

[JP]

did you leave the car sitting on the wheels with no driveshafts in the hubs while you swapped the motor?

If so, time to replace the wheel bearings.

[Talasas]

- I double checked for the backing plate when I had it off, they clear fine.

- turning the wheel when jacked up is free spinning except for the usual minor brake pad drag.

- I'm not sure about over-tensioning, I know they have to be pretty damn tight. When I took off the assembly to check I made sure I tightened it up again properly

- the wheel didn't seem to wobble at all, neither horizontal or verical movement.

- the car was on jack stands the entire time during the conversion. Although I've never heard that one before... can you elaborate on what happens please JP?

thanks guys, bit of a tough one this.

[JP]

the wheel bearings need the CV spline in them to retain their integrity, I know of quite a few AE92's in Brisbane that have required the bearings to be replaced after they were left sitting on the wheels with the shafts out while an engine was rebuilt or conversion took place.

[EldarO]

JP, how long does it have to be? or is it the initial drop that causes the wheel bearings to root themselves?

im just curious, as i re-fitted my SV21 motor today, but i left the CV's in, so from what your saying, im not in any danger, but this is also the firs ttime ive heard of it.

does it happen to all FWD's? or specific models?!?

Elmo.

[Dale]

Logic tells me it would happen for any FWD, I've seen and heard of it on a couple of different models now... basically without the CV spline in the hub the weight ends up on the wheel bearing instead of being centered on the hub/cv spline. I dare say the same thing would probably happen for RWD's with IRS if you rolled it without the axles in (not sure why you'd need to though lol)

It's more likely to happen if you roll the car without them in than if you just drop it, although dropping it could do it too, it would be less likely to

I've got an old (stuffed) outer CV joint which I can use to put in if the car has to be put back down with the axles out, just the CV joint itself so you have no dangly bits that need to rotate when you move it, putting these in while you sort the motor out would save you $120 odd bucks on new wheel bearings! (I need to find another one then I'll have a pair)

[EldarO]

ive already got the motor in and shiz, so im not worried, i just wasnt told about this earlier, lucky i didnt stuff it!

thanks for the info fellas, + rep

Elmo.

[Dale]

I didn't know about it recently till it happened to one of the cars I'd done the motor on, the noise had us puzzled for ages, then asking around a couple of other people had the same thing happen to them.. so we put new wheel bearings in and the noise disappeared

[Talasas]

Hmmm, I guess I'll just have to bite the bullet and replace the bearings - they've been giving me the shits from day one anyway.

One the plus side, now's a better time than ever to try this experiment I've been trying to conjure up involving the suspension/hub assembly.

Cheers guys.

[Talasas]

Okay, being short on cash for the time being to try my original drivetrain idea, I need to fix this to shut the damn car up, so bump we go.

Basically this arvo I jacked the car up and took the hub centre out, looking inside (and giving it a good fingering) the ball bearings roll nicely (both sets), there's plenty of grease inside, the seals look ok and the hub centre is smooth (no scoring). The hub bolt was done up adequately tight.

So what else am I looking at here?

It's starting to point to the CVs. When the car is jacked up there is no noise even at full lock, the only thing I can comment on is that the drive shaft (in the middle) looks like it moves up and down a bit but whether this is just the nature of the CV joint itself.

Interestingly looking them up on wikipedia for curiousty said this:

Wear in the outer joint usually shows up as vibration at certain speeds, a bit like the vibration caused by an unbalanced wheel. To determine if the joint is worn, find a big empty car park and drive the car slowly in tight circles, left and right. Worn joints will make a rhythmic clicking or cracking noise. Wear in the inner joints shows up as a "clunk" or "pop" when applying power, or if severe, when lifting off the throttle.

I have all of these symptoms.

Comments?

[JP]

if it's clicking, rebuild the CV

[Talasas]

It's much more like a cracking sound, like a tree falling over. About as loud too, when turning right under power. I also get the clonk with power on/off and it's not the ball joints or engine mounts.

I've looked everywhere for signs of rubbing and there's none, I can't think of anything else...

[Cuzzo]

So have you changed the bearing?