Microtech Or Autronic???

[Draven]

Rod... re: needing an aftermarket TPS on the autronic (SM4). How is that going to go with the 2jz-gte vvti FBW throttle?

[Rallystanza]

Well i bought an SM2 today to contol my 4A turbo.

Will see how it al lgoes.

Rod, you speak of this TPS issue with the autronic. Can you shed some light on this comment for me please?

Thanks,

Jeremy

[TheToyman75]

Mick,

Autronic doesn't actually make a digital dash, thats another of Ray Halls liberties I believe its not a bad thing altho I haven't had one come through work yet. I can't remeber who actually makes them.

Shane,

I think your tuner may have a little ill informed and probably pushing an ideal set up rather than a required one. The CDI unit is often not much more than setting up an ignition with multiple aftermarket ignitors and they are a wicked bit of gear. You sure as hell don't have to run one tho. As for the coils, Genuine Toyota coils work fine in fact some of the twin post coils like the 1GGZE or 4AGZE are awesome bits of gear. I have 4 GZE coils for my 3T-GTE. The 2TGTE will run the bosch MEC718 items. The SM4 has come along way with its ability to work with factory ignition systems tho, its allot more able than the SMC or SM2 and won't need a Reluctor interface.

The autronic boost control is indeed closed loop so yes, no wastegate creep is exactly how it works. As for varying boost levels I'm not 100% sure, its not like an aftermarket unit where you have a stack of flexibility but I think there is some level of programability. You'd have to speak to the tuner tho on that one mate I'm just the receptionist

[kingmick]

No prob Rod, i had a vague memory of it being talked about 4 years or so ago, hence the question, but the way i feel after 3 weeks of the bloody flu i wouldnt count on my memory much at the moment

[TheToyman75]

Well i bought an SM2 today to contol my 4A turbo.

Will see how it al lgoes.

Rod, you speak of this TPS issue with the autronic. Can you shed some light on this comment for me please?

Thanks,

Jeremy

Jeremy/Draven,

To assertain if your TPS is suitable for your SM2/SM4 speak to your tuner, he will need to see the wiring diagram for your TPS, from memory the 4A one is an early style like the 2TG one so will most likely need to be replaced. The 2J items are probably ok but I really don't know for sure. Refer comment re receptionist and I'm on holidays so not at work right now

[kingmick]

The poor blokes must be flat out Rod How many phone calls you had? hahahaha

[The Witzl]

Wiring in an Autronic is just as easy as a Microtech...... even though BvD will jump in here and tell the story of my "special" wiring on his 7M.....

To me personally, i find the Autronic easier to wire, because you dont have to second guess the functionality of the ECU against the system you are implementing.
The microtech wiring diagrams just say "connect red wire to blue", "this wire to that wire", etc etc.... and no explanation of HOW those circuits function within the ECU (nor will they answer such questions either!) - so if you have something a little out of the ordinary, you have to assume the functionality of the microtech.
The Autronic SM4 (unsure on SMC) on the other hand, is configurable at the tuner level. Meaning that you wire up what you want to which input/output (yes, you can select a pinout as an input OR output), and tell your tuner how you wired it up and to what type of sensor/signal. Of course you have to keep to the correct designations where they are assigned (eg, crank position, crank reference, injectors etc etc) but these assigned signals are selectable in their type through the tuning software - unlike Microtech, where you have to hope they will still support your ECU and reconfigure it for you.
...... but then again I tend to think into wiring a little bit more than most do. I want to understand HOW and WHY something works, rather than just connect wires.


Dont get me wrong, Microtech's are great. But for someone like me who is likely to change their engine configuration, sensor types, injectors sizes etc Microtech is a pain to have to get reconfigured each time, and just doesnt offer as much flexibility.

To me, that is a BIG keypoint with selecting an ecu. I need that flexibility. If i find my dissy isnt giving an accurate enough ignition signal so i then install a crank trigger, i dont want to have to send my ecu away to make it work. What if i then turbocharge..... you get the idea

... and as for the ignition system, well Glen didnt get a CDI system with his SM4, and he's running the 7M wasted spark coils and was able to run 6 coil packs but chose not to in order to save costs. No need for any extra spending other than the cost of the coils and ignitor(s) (Glen used an RB20DET ignitor - 6 channel, $100) to run multiple coil packs


Dont take this as argumentative please. I'm just putting forward what my position is regarding programmable ECUs, and what I have experienced.

As everyone has already said, it's up to the individual to choose what is best for them - and in reality there is no single "best" ecu for all cases.

[The Witzl]

Jeremy/Draven,

To assertain if your TPS is suitable for your SM2/SM4 speak to your tuner, he will need to see the wiring diagram for your TPS, from memory the 4A one is an early style like the 2TG one so will most likely need to be replaced. The 2J items are probably ok but I really don't know for sure. Refer comment re receptionist and I'm on holidays so not at work right now

4A will not need a new TPS, it is a "wiper" style TPS (ie, variable output) just the same as all Toyota TPS units post the onset of "TCCS" ECU systems back in the mid 1980's. You will only have to not use one of the 4 wires (IDL is not used) from the TPS, thats all

Same goes for the 2JZ.

It's only the old TPS units from analogue EFI engines that are "switch" type, where they are literally a 3-position switch -> IDLE, OFF IDLE, OPEN THROTTLE. These will be your old 5M-E, 18R-GE, 2T-GE, 3T-GTE, etc etc.

[Rallystanza]

4A will not need a new TPS, it is a "wiper" style TPS (ie, variable output) just the same as all Toyota TPS units post the onset of "TCCS" ECU systems back in the mid 1980's. You will only have to not use one of the 4 wires (IDL is not used) from the TPS, thats all

Same goes for the 2JZ.

It's only the old TPS units from analogue EFI engines that are "switch" type, where they are literally a 3-position switch -> IDLE, OFF IDLE, OPEN THROTTLE. These will be your old 5M-E, 18R-GE, 2T-GE, 3T-GTE, etc etc.

I hope your right, thats abit of good news for ye ol 4a.

Thanks Karl,

Jez

[takai]

Wiring in an Autronic is just as easy as a Microtech...... even though BvD will jump in here and tell the story of my "special" wiring on his 7M.....

To me personally, i find the Autronic easier to wire, because you dont have to second guess the functionality of the ECU against the system you are implementing.
The microtech wiring diagrams just say "connect red wire to blue", "this wire to that wire", etc etc.... and no explanation of HOW those circuits function within the ECU (nor will they answer such questions either!) - so if you have something a little out of the ordinary, you have to assume the functionality of the microtech.
The Autronic SM4 (unsure on SMC) on the other hand, is configurable at the tuner level. Meaning that you wire up what you want to which input/output (yes, you can select a pinout as an input OR output), and tell your tuner how you wired it up and to what type of sensor/signal. Of course you have to keep to the correct designations where they are assigned (eg, crank position, crank reference, injectors etc etc) but these assigned signals are selectable in their type through the tuning software - unlike Microtech, where you have to hope they will still support your ECU and reconfigure it for you.
...... but then again I tend to think into wiring a little bit more than most do. I want to understand HOW and WHY something works, rather than just connect wires.


Dont get me wrong, Microtech's are great. But for someone like me who is likely to change their engine configuration, sensor types, injectors sizes etc Microtech is a pain to have to get reconfigured each time, and just doesnt offer as much flexibility.

To me, that is a BIG keypoint with selecting an ecu. I need that flexibility. If i find my dissy isnt giving an accurate enough ignition signal so i then install a crank trigger, i dont want to have to send my ecu away to make it work. What if i then turbocharge..... you get the idea

... and as for the ignition system, well Glen didnt get a CDI system with his SM4, and he's running the 7M wasted spark coils and was able to run 6 coil packs but chose not to in order to save costs. No need for any extra spending other than the cost of the coils and ignitor(s) (Glen used an RB20DET ignitor - 6 channel, $100) to run multiple coil packs


Dont take this as argumentative please. I'm just putting forward what my position is regarding programmable ECUs, and what I have experienced.

As everyone has already said, it's up to the individual to choose what is best for them - and in reality there is no single "best" ecu for all cases.

Agreed wholeheartedly, same reason why i love my Haltech over the Microtech.

Oh yeah, some of the Nissan igniters have been reported to not function nicely with the upper models of ECU. For example the CA18DET and SR20DET ignition modules tend to fry themselves with a sharp and clean pulse. I replicated this a while ago with a simple switching unit at work, blows the ground clean off.
I have also heard of Autronics being able to produce enough charge current to arc weld the spark plug electrodes to themselves which says a lot for the ignition systems

[The Witzl]

glen hasnt had any issues with his RB20DET ignitor..... yet.....

[Draven]

Ahh, fond memories of microtechs and their "special" wiring diagrams (where you end up guessing wiring configurations to get the damn thing to work).

Karl - spill the beans on your skilled wiring. I plan to wire up the SM4 myself (as I did my microtech), so any help would be appreciated (and I know Mos is just itching to laugh at you)

[Billzilla]

Guys, if you're going to not spend much money then I'd highly recommend going for an Adaptronic. They've got a heap of features and seem to be very flexible.
From what I've seen, nearly as good as an Autronic in a lot of ways, heaps better than a Microtech in just about every way and cost less.

[off-road]

Just to clear up a point on Autronic boost control - only the SM4 is closed loop.
Boost control on the SM2 is quite tedius to set up but works very well once configured.
I assume the SM4 boost control would be a lot easier with closed loop.

[The Witzl]

my special wiring was because i was kinda "beta testing" the SM4..... was about the third one that SAS had delt with being that they were officially released about a week later.....

all i had to work with was a simple diagram and no instructions, which was expected since it was pre-release.... and i just made a couple of errors of assumption....being:

# injectors are in firing order, not cylinder order like i wired them
# similar deal with ignition outputs (maybe other way around, i cant remember)
.....
....... and then there was the wire to nowhere. I kinda forgot to wire up ignition 12V to the ISCV, it was all loomed up, and connected to nothing.