ITB Conversion on 16 valve 4AGE

[mattysshop]

* reading

thanks - i have a spare set of ITB's wondering if i should try and chuck it on my smallport for shits and giggles.. and obviously reporting my findings with more measurements..

[xero]

well i pretty much proved that it runs fine on the stock ecu when i did it about 8 years ago......

initially i had my map sensor hooked up to the vac nipples along the bottom - giving it a single feed, what i forgot to do is the same for the fuel reg, and run it off one of the fittings on the s/t ITB's.. which as i know now is NOT on the right side of the throttle body... this was causing part throttle richness/overfueling...

later i did go full after market (adaptronic).. but this was after about 6 months of daily driving it with the stock ecu, and the FPR/map hooked up to a vac block.

its far from being a 'pig' and you don't have to bodge anything other than wire in the 20v TPS (reverse of 16v TPS)

i don't run cold start on mine currently, and it's got a standard intake... no cold start works fine... idle control was fine... it was almost a little carbyish when you first started if it was parked outside on a 2 deg morning..

cranked fire and give it a few small revs on the throttle - then it would idle at 800.. when warm it would go to around 900. (thats how i set mine at least)

i remember taking a picture of a boost gauge i hooked up to the vacuum block, i'll see if i can find it as i cannot remember what it read, and i also throew a mates wide band logger on there to check AFR's and MAP. i have a few screen shots of part throttle, and WOT.

once i sorted the FPR vac (such a noob mistake on my part) it ran extremly well, and still averaged approx 400km to a ae86 tank.. mixed city/freeway.. which was about 80-100km's less than i got previously with a stock bigport (car was a jdm ae86 coupe), and with an AE92 GZE (got the same fuel economy).

matty, i knew about your car from back when you did a billion years ago and often reference it. like with all rules your is the exception.
in regards to all the other stuff i have a built smallport (~200hp @ 9500rpm) with autronic and open ITBs that also does about 400kms to a tank cruising around and a lot whole lot less when on track (TPS needs resetting and about 30 mins on the dyno for clean up). TRDEE has been in and driven my AE86 and can provide evidence.

in regards to the original question it more a direct answer to the SIMPLEST and most straight forward result the OP wanted. while yes your's did work, you have the skills and expertise to make it work, we have no idea of the OP does or not. given the amount of work i have in my engine and using the T3 + programmable ECU and then the amount of work that went into making yours work the most straight forward and cost effect is as Dneg and myself described.

[maj]

You could also consider for less complexity for finding a tuner etc. A 20v swap and using factory ECU might be on the cards? I'd imagine T3 adapter + ITB's + ECU and tuning would still be cheaper, but not by much?

Doesn't really answer the question either though.

[Sam_Q]

I have been trying to develop some manifolds that address all bar one problem that the T3 ones have. Still undecided if I will go with the carbon fiber tubes as per that thread or get them cast.

http://www.ae86drivingclub.com.au/fo...m-carbon-fiber


Wiso: not my way of doing things but I have to hand it to you that's really creative

dnegative: thank you very much for your guide. I was stuck with my manifold development because I couldn't work out why the T3 ones where angled up. I read a while ago that they used to be straight and where updated to a tilted up design instead due to water pipe clearance but I couldn't figure it out. Now thanks to that thread I know that tilt up, down or keep the adapter straight I won't have an issue because my vacuum outlets won't be in the middle. I was planning on having provision for two threaded holes for each cylinder and in the bottom of the intake flange instead. This means that even with a short adapter it will clear the pipes fine. I will probably keep it straight so as to keep the tooling costs down.


Mods: delete the first part of the message or just the link if it's not appropriate

[xero]

Sam, one other thing to add to your design maybe is have enough angle or whatever on the adapter to clear an AE/KE brake booster with 100mm stacks. a simple fix that i will be doing shortly is to shave a couple of millimetres off the back of the T3 adapter at a 5deg angle so it clears the booster.

[old_mr2]

To the OP, any particular reason you want to do this? If its for more power, you will be disappointed.

[Sam_Q]

Sam, one other thing to add to your design maybe is have enough angle or whatever on the adapter to clear an AE/KE brake booster with 100mm stacks. a simple fix that i will be doing shortly is to shave a couple of millimetres off the back of the T3 adapter at a 5deg angle so it clears the booster.

I had a look and it seems to me that with a straight manifold it will have more clearance in the end that one that's tilted up, unless it's tilted right up.

To the OP, any particular reason you want to do this? If its for more power, you will be disappointed.

From what I hear there is a nice gain to be had from this conversion? beg to differ?



Now with my own manifold I had 3/4 of it 3D printd without the port tubes. I would like to do a test fit, post a pic of it and hopefully people can tell me if they think it's going to work. Perhaps I should open a new thread though.

[xero]

[QUOTE=Sam_Q;1584820]I had a look and it seems to me that with a straight manifold it will have more clearance in the end that one that's tilted up, unless it's tilted right up.[\QUOTE]

its more an issue when fitting the 100m stacks. even with 70mm stacks from T3 it still fouls on the booster.

From what I hear there is a nice gain to be had from this conversion? beg to differ?

im going with Sam on this as well...

[jondee86]

To the OP, any particular reason you want to do this? If its for more power, you will be disappointed.

Fair comment if the only mod that is carried out on the engine is to convert to ITB's. As every man and his proverbial dog is quick to point out, the ITB conversion will only return some benefit if it is done in conjunction with some other performance enhancing mods. Once you have to ability to get more air into the engine, you need to look at improving breathing (cam, head mods etc) and at getting the gases out. And once you have made those kinds of changes, your fuel and timing will be so far out, you really have to bite the bullet and get an aftermarket ECU to tune the beast

FWIW I am running an unopened smallport on ITB's cams and basic Adaptronic e420c. It pulls like a train from less than 2000rpm, and rev limits at 8000. It won't win any prizes in the dyno Olympics, but it sure is fun to drive, and sounds great into the bargain. Just my 2c...

Cheers... jondee86

[oldeskewltoy]

in addition....

MOST (95%??) of ITB installs are done incorrectly! Incorrectly means little or no attention paid to correct adjustments - to linkages, or air flow.


as far as .02 ¢.... no ITBs on this.... http://youtu.be/oC73j3m_Hf4

[jondee86]

Like it ^^^^

This is all the way uphill in 3rd after the last downchange... and there are some quite tight corners on the way up...



Sorry about the music... forgot to turn it off

Cheers... jondee86