Wilwoods - worth the coin?

[hks7mgt]

i didn't catch what you are intending to use the car for. for best bang for buck, i'd suggest to sort out a set of new JDM vented rotors and matching calipers/MC (if they are different), service your calipers and master cylinder back to new factory working condition, new brake lines, sort out a set of decent pads (but nothing that will eat your rotors though) and go hell for leather.

this will sort out your brake fad issues and you'll find a decent performance increase as well. If you are looking at braking from 200Km/h down to 40Km/h within 40meters of tarmac to take a hair pin over and over and over, then YES, sort yourself larger rotors with 4/6/8/10/1000 piston calipers or what ever tickles your fancy. but if your prancing about the street with the occasional track day or hill climb event, then a well serviced brake setup with awesome pads will rock.

Didn't AE86s came out with optional rear disc brakes too? Sort out a rear end as well. You'll most likely need to upgrade the brake master if you go to rear disc as Toyota does and i found a nice 7/8inch bore MC from 4wheel disc brake corolla's like the AE92 onwards that should bolt onto your brake booster. the 7/8inch bore gives you a better feel over the 1inch bore from the Camry's that's hard as a rock.

i slightly went off topic, but you get the drift. Unless you're pulling huge power and huge speeds, then you'd be very surprised how a well serviced factory parts will perform.

[Shakotan_Aaron]

thats not really very good bang for buck, when you do the costs.

ae86 JDM callipers $200 (normally 150-250)
seal kits $60
Disks $180
pads $120 (QFM A1RM)
Braided front lines $120
total
$680

Yes you could possibly cut some corners there or get something from your mate at where ever but they are the lowest common prices for readily available parts. So when you look at it that way, your getting larger disks much lighter callipers etc. Id say bang for buck it would be really hard to go past the willwoods, im not sure what the quality of the disks are that the T3 kit uses.

You dont need to change BMC for disk brake rear, simply remove the restricter or from the proportioning valve.

Having said the above I did do overhauled JDM set-up on my old ke70 was a HUGE upgrade over the crappy wornout stock stuff.

[Fantapants]

the discs are pretty crap tbh... espes with some aggressive pads.

jdm is easy to cook really. Great for putting round the street, but any decent hills drive will have them go off.

[stidnam]

FYI I rang up the RTA technical line and asked about the dust boots and they said that it is not an issue. I don't have that in writing though.

[trdee]

anything not in writing is useless. people have been told that 20 valves dont need engineering in an ae92 on the rta technical line too...

[BLK_20v]

anything not in writing is useless. people have been told that 20 valves dont need engineering in an ae92 on the rta technical line too...

True... The RTA's left arm doesn't know what the right arm is doing... I don't have to worry about engineering as this is being purpose built as a dedicated track car.

I guess the point to this thread is given the flex wilwoods experience compared to the other products out there, am I better off just getting larger rotars and a good pad as willwoods don't appear to be a really good upgrade.

Spending $$$ on good products isn't an issue for me, but I hate wasting money and look for the sweet spot where bang for buck / return on investment is at its highest.

The do it once and do it right attitude to avoid a 60k build that really should have been 15-20k.

[rsdeo]

I asked you a valid question... you didn't reply.

I was going to try to help you source calipers that would bolt straight up to your strut, no brackets required. There may be some out there. After that just source the correct disc.

Why waste my time?

[rally22]

Hi just saw you post re wilwood brakes, I have a set of these for $950 this includes Dynalite calipers and adapters and braided brake lines and rotors and performance street pads, all the parts are new from the states, I didnt use them as I went in a different direction with the project I am building.

[Fantapants]

True... The RTA's left arm doesn't know what the right arm is doing... I don't have to worry about engineering as this is being purpose built as a dedicated track car.

I guess the point to this thread is given the flex wilwoods experience compared to the other products out there, am I better off just getting larger rotars and a good pad as willwoods don't appear to be a really good upgrade.

Spending $$$ on good products isn't an issue for me, but I hate wasting money and look for the sweet spot where bang for buck / return on investment is at its highest.

The do it once and do it right attitude to avoid a 60k build that really should have been 15-20k.

what tyres are you planning on running?

this flex is an absolute clamping pressure issue. Yes they flex more than heavier calipers. Yes this can be an issue, but only if you are running SUPER STICKY tyres. On virtually anything you plan to run on the street, in my experiance, the point where your tyre will lock is WELL below the flex threshold. So unless your running slicks or mega r spec everywhere, you will lockup and crash long before you have to worry about the minor flex.

[LittleRedSpirit]

I have the TTT wilwood ae86 brakes on my ae71.

Absolutely amazing bit of kit and many advantages over other ways to upgrade ae86 fronts.

Great price for the level of hardware, I got beautiful bauer rotors with mine, they have a really minimal x factor (spoke interferance), they are far lighter than steel or even the massive fc calipers, great pad choice, comes with braided lines, works amazingly, the only problem being ae86 hubs have shit tiny bearings that wear out every 15-20 thousand k without fail under big braking and rim stresses. Hence why my new coilovers are based on ra40 struts. Plus you can buy rotors and fit them, not have to redrill or machine down the rotors to work like many FC upgrades.


By the time you buy FC caliper - $200
Rebuild them - $150
Buy pads - $150
Rotors - $200
brackets - $250-300 (rip job fo sho)
and do the work yourself, you spent more than the wilwoods and you generally have a far worse x factor.

One advantage of the FC would be that with some of the rotor options you can get 14s on easily, wheres TTT kit needs 15s.

The dust boot issue is a huge myth.

The ap calipers that people rave about on high end commodoores and falcons dont have them, and theres 2013 model cars coming out with them.

Whoever made that up was just a a negative person. A lot of people I know with 35 years racing experience rave about wilwoods and almost everything they make. I have absolutely no quality issues having owned them for 4 years now. The rotrs I got were German made Bauer rotors, which have lasted immacculately. I did hear at some point fastbrakes(the company that actually created this wilwood kit that TTT sells) swapped to a shit rotor but after complaints, sent out better kit to those affected and changed back to a better supplier, thus ending any quality issues.

Unfortunately there is a great propensity for tall poppy syndrome here in Australia, so whenever someone is a little bit jealous of your success, they cant start putting shit on nice things they dont own fast enough. I feel this has happened to Wilwoods in the Australian car scene. A lot of people seem to have the pretece that some secondhand whit from a jap import is somethign special, it isnt. Give me new forged alloy dynalite calipers any day of the week over anything secondhand from a road car. If you are worried about not having dust seals, then just take advantage of the fact that your wilwood aclipers are easy to service and pop them apart, clean them and put them back together.

In realuity a lot of wilwood calipers have no dust seals and they get used for off road racing, buggies, gokarts, dune buggies, the list goes on. If they had any issues with dirt then they couldnt use them in these applications at all surely, nor could they use any other similarly designed ap/brembo etc.

To summarise, haters gonna hate.

[e30-323ti]

IMHO: The main advantage in going to a aftermarket caliper (Wilwood, AP, Alcon etc...) is they have standard pads shapes/thickness and a wide range of compounds available.
These standard pad shapes are often A LOT cheaper than those for a specific model vehicle (eg. finding decent track pads for AE101 2 pots).
And you go through a few pads at the track, so the likes of Wilwoods start paying for themself soon enough.

Caliper Flex, when compared to the compromise of a sliding caliper, is not even in the same discussion really, and would be V.hard for anyone but professional race drivers to notice (if at all).
Also, check that you are not exceeding the calipers max pressure rating, I recall some Dyna & Super Lites were not rated over 1000psi and were not suitable for replacing factory power assisted brakes.

There are also Wilwood calipers available with dust-boots should the be required, eg. the Dyna Pro.
As for their calipers without dust boots, if you read the info supplied with then, they need periodic maintence that is more intensive than you would expect from an OEM caliper.
To say they don't have issues with dust/dirt is not quite correct.
Dust boots are also not used in these type of aftermarket 'race' calipers becuase of the higher brake temperatures expected results in melted bust boots.

My 2c

[JustenGT8]

I have the TTT wilwood ae86 brakes on my ae71.

Absolutely amazing bit of kit and many advantages over other ways to upgrade ae86 fronts.

Great price for the level of hardware, I got beautiful bauer rotors with mine, they have a really minimal x factor (spoke interferance), they are far lighter than steel or even the massive fc calipers, great pad choice, comes with braided lines, works amazingly, the only problem being ae86 hubs have shit tiny bearings that wear out every 15-20 thousand k without fail under big braking and rim stresses. Hence why my new coilovers are based on ra40 struts. Plus you can buy rotors and fit them, not have to redrill or machine down the rotors to work like many FC upgrades.


By the time you buy FC caliper - $200
Rebuild them - $150
Buy pads - $150
Rotors - $200
brackets - $250-300 (rip job fo sho)
and do the work yourself, you spent more than the wilwoods and you generally have a far worse x factor.

One advantage of the FC would be that with some of the rotor options you can get 14s on easily, wheres TTT kit needs 15s.

The dust boot issue is a huge myth.

The ap calipers that people rave about on high end commodoores and falcons dont have them, and theres 2013 model cars coming out with them.

Whoever made that up was just a a negative person. A lot of people I know with 35 years racing experience rave about wilwoods and almost everything they make. I have absolutely no quality issues having owned them for 4 years now. The rotrs I got were German made Bauer rotors, which have lasted immacculately. I did hear at some point fastbrakes(the company that actually created this wilwood kit that TTT sells) swapped to a shit rotor but after complaints, sent out better kit to those affected and changed back to a better supplier, thus ending any quality issues.

Unfortunately there is a great propensity for tall poppy syndrome here in Australia, so whenever someone is a little bit jealous of your success, they cant start putting shit on nice things they dont own fast enough. I feel this has happened to Wilwoods in the Australian car scene. A lot of people seem to have the pretece that some secondhand whit from a jap import is somethign special, it isnt. Give me new forged alloy dynalite calipers any day of the week over anything secondhand from a road car. If you are worried about not having dust seals, then just take advantage of the fact that your wilwood aclipers are easy to service and pop them apart, clean them and put them back together.

In realuity a lot of wilwood calipers have no dust seals and they get used for off road racing, buggies, gokarts, dune buggies, the list goes on. If they had any issues with dirt then they couldnt use them in these applications at all surely, nor could they use any other similarly designed ap/brembo etc.

To summarise, haters gonna hate.

Jeez mate, who busted your chops? Sensitive much?

Same can be said for the china spec brake gear (which I have run for years now to great success and no issues).

So yeah Wilwoods are good.

But, the sticking piston has been an issue for some in the past and was a real issue. With tighter build spec calipers and material these days if may not be as much of a concern. Of more concern though is your engineers requirements. The two I have used in the past required a caliper with seals...no discussion to be entered into. So, if you want a legal setup (must therefore be engineered) you may be required to use a sealed caliper despite all the evidence demonstrating it's not required. Just one of those things.