Poly-Urathane VS' Rubber

[Esteban]

Witzl,
...I'll dig out the book I have been reading and without breaching copyright I'll quote some of the contents regarding bushing materials...

Is the book you're thinking of "chassis engineering" by Herb Adams. Good book!

[Rodger]

Esteban,

Yes it is the Herb Adams book and it is a good book. It starts from the basics of what tyre grip is all about, 'The circle of traction" theory and build from there.

Regards

Rodger

[Smokey228]

ill have to get my hand onto this book, sounds like an intresting read...

[Toobs]

Re: What grease to use.
Use a lithium complex grease like Castrol APXT or Gulf Western Blue Lithium grease.

[roadsailing]

i just put in my front adjustable swaybar, used lithium soap grease on the D bushes, which has mineral oil in it too. i thought it was the right gear at the time, then i decided i didnt care anyway and just whacked it on.

then re-used the old rubber bushes on the control arm link mounts, best of both worlds.

[Hybrid]

I have just brought Superpro polyurethane bushes (as sold by Whiteline) for the upper and lower control arms of my car (MA70 Supra).

I see here alot of people adivse they need to be serviced every 12 months, my question is how is this service done?

Do the bushes need to be removed, regreased, then installed again?

If this is the case it could prove to be an expensive process considering labour costs.

[o_man_ra23]

Driftspec - the labour costs you speak of should be able to be performed by the home mechanic, as the parts of joints that need special tools to remove wont need servicing, however things like the lower control arm bushes which have to be pressed in... dont forget that the centre pin is a floating item, and will need servicing. also sides of the bush rubs on the control arm mount on your xmember, so make sure you grease that too.

My queiry for the knowledgable ppl here is what would be a good choice for a street car often used for long distance business trips, which gets the occasional rally pounding. A friend is about to do up all the suspension on his RA65, including 15mm raised springs, and would like to know what is best for this application. comfort is not that much of an issue.

Cheers, Owen

[Hybrid]

I am still a little confused.

I guess what I am asking is when the bushes are in the car and I get say 12 months down the track, what maintenence do I need to do, and how do I do it?

[Callifo]

Ive got a full set of Poly Urethane bushes to put on this holiday for the sprinter, honestly I cant see the ride getting much harsher. Either sprinter suspensions are naturally like this or all the rubber bushes are 100% shagged. I feel bumps that I cant even see in the road

[o_man_ra23]

Driftspec,
The maintenance involves disassembling the poly joint, regreasing where you would grease in the first place, and putting it all back together. For example, the rear trailing arms on an RA23(poly bushes) usually have 2 halves to the bush, which fit inside the circular housing at the end of the trailing arm. They also have a metal pin which goes through the middle of these bushes, and the mounting bolt goes through this. To service it, you remove the mounting bolt, lower or raise the end of the trailing arm so the bush is clear of the mount, then remove the 2 halves of the bush from the housing and remove the pin. Grease where the bush mates to the housing and where it mates to the pin, re assemble, then grease where the bush rubs on the mount. put the end back in the mount, and put the bolt back on. use a similar technique for all other urethance bushes used.

Hope this helps, and helps anyone else with a similar question.

Cheers, Owen

[Wiggles]

Hmm, i need to replace the flogged out bushes in the Sprinter (all of them) and was going to get the bling bling poly jobs.
What? you have to pull 'em all apart every 12 months?

Frigg. That.

Ok, if rubber is good for a comfy ride and Poly good for hard driving, is there an in between solution?
i.e. softer than poly urathane but harded than OEM rubber.

Are aftermarket rubber bushes worth bothering with? or are Toyota parts better/same price/ fit better?

[Hybrid]

Driftspec,
The maintenance involves disassembling the poly joint, regreasing where you would grease in the first place, and putting it all back together. For example, the rear trailing arms on an RA23(poly bushes) usually have 2 halves to the bush, which fit inside the circular housing at the end of the trailing arm. They also have a metal pin which goes through the middle of these bushes, and the mounting bolt goes through this. To service it, you remove the mounting bolt, lower or raise the end of the trailing arm so the bush is clear of the mount, then remove the 2 halves of the bush from the housing and remove the pin. Grease where the bush mates to the housing and where it mates to the pin, re assemble, then grease where the bush rubs on the mount. put the end back in the mount, and put the bolt back on. use a similar technique for all other urethance bushes used.

Hope this helps, and helps anyone else with a similar question.

Cheers, Owen

Yep perfect answer

I knew you would say the bush needed to be removed ...

[Rodger]

As far as I was aware only the centre metal sleeve needed grease in between it and the poly bush as the arm is designed to pivot around the inner sleeve and not around the bush.

It is then possible to drill and tap a hole in the outer arm for a grease nipple and continue the hole through the bush to the inner sleeve.

Then a grease gun is used to put the grease in.

The Poly bushes I have installed and used had a little plastic packet of a black grease for the initial installation job.

Wiggles,

Between brands there is a range of hardness for poly but nothing really between rubber and poly.

It maybe hard to find aftermarket rubber replacement bushes, I've never tried as I bought new OEM parts for my TA-22, twenty years ago. Toyota may not stock anything used before 1980 and there are Toyota bushes and then there are Toyota bushes.

If anyone gets a chance, compare TA/RA early Celicas with something like a T18 or late KE/TE with similar rear suspension set ups.

Solid rubber OEM bushes are the go as opposed to the OEM ones with only a half rubber filled bush.

Regards

Rodger

[Big rob]

I was also going to mention the grease nipple idea. Would this be viable. It would make things soo much easier. Also i was under the impression most people go for after makket poly bushes mainly due to the obserd priced toyota want for the OEM ones.

As with something that is inbetween OEM rubber and poly, what about the softride bushes from Noltec?

And could someone clarify to me, is there anymore bushes then the upper and lower contol arms on a GZ20 soarer, i'm guesing they would be the same as an MA70?

[o_man_ra23]

Grease nipple idea is great in theory, and would save a lot of trouble. PROBLEM!! because the bushes only pivot a small way, the grease would not penetrate all the way around the pin/trailing arm end. Thus, you would get good lubrication on the bush around where the nipple is, but at the opposite end of the circle, you would get a dry spot, which will rub, fracture, and cost money. Also, because the bushes are not glued/solidly mounted to the outer where you would be putting the grease nipple, the hole you drill through the bush will move slightly, and in an extreme situation(like after a few years, if you dont pull the bush apart every so often) it will migrate and actually block itself, and you would get a dry pin.

Personally I cannot think of an easy way out of the maintenance schedule... if anyone has done something with success, i would be as interested to know about it as everyone else.

Cheers, Owen