Calling all 1JZ guru's

[BEVANI]

ok so my ma61 is at the auto sparkyhavin the 1jzgte wired up and things are looking good but one problem.. no spark.... now im sure the sparky will work it out but im wondering if anyone can give there ideas, advice and thoughts on the situation. everything works. fuel, ignition, all that jazz.... but from what ive been told there is no signal to the coils. sparky has mentioned the ignitor and the crank angle sensor... the loom is from a jzz30 and i did notice a small female 2 pin plug that comes out of the loom right next to the ignitor plugs but connects to nothing or should say has nothing connected to it. could this be one of the problems? does anyone know what connects to it? it might not even be the problem... also noticed the sparky had a node pluged into something in the intake manifold just lookin for some light at the end of the tunnel here...

[wilbo666]

i did notice a small female 2 pin plug that comes out of the loom right next to the ignitor plugs but connects to nothing or should say has nothing connected to it. could this be one of the problems? does anyone know what connects to it?

That plug is for a noise suppressor, which is really just a capacitor. You don't need it.

i.e. as seen on this picture (White item on the side of the igniter).






In regards to no ignition, I'd be checking to see if you have power to the igniter, and the coils firstly

Cheers
Wilbo

[BEVANI]

cheers wilbo, ill remember to mention that to the sparky.. is it possible the ignitor itself could be toast? is there any real way to tell? i remember the sparky saying there was signal to the ignitor (he might have been talkin about something else) but nothing coming out... the plastic clips on top of the coils have been replaced, new spark plugs.. so connections are fine maybe the coils are kaput...

[wilbo666]

Given that it is 1JZ into MA61 to me it is more than likely that one of the +B wires hasn't been connected....

Of one of the ignition wires...

Would be very unlikely for all six coils to fail

So...

>Power to Coils (Check for voltage at the coil plugs)
>Power to igniter
>Ground to igniter
>Signal to igniter from ECU (highly unlikely that all 6 ignition drivers on the ECU would be stuffed)
>Igniter (unlikely but possible, check for signal to igniter first tho )

Cheers
Wilbo

[BEVANI]

sparky has everything hooked up and working.. it turns over, there is fuel... can the motor still turn over without all the correct power wires hooked up?

[BEVANI]

Given that it is 1JZ into MA61 to me it is more than likely that one of the +B wires hasn't been connected....

>Ground to igniter


Cheers
Wilbo

the igniter has to be "grounded" to the car? or is it ground throught the loom?
cheers

[jzk25]

The sparky must be a bit of a gimp if he can't check for power at the coils and ignitor. The ignitor is grounded to the block in the loom, the power supply to the coils and ignitor are common and not the same circuit as the injectors and ecu power. Normally it's a black/orange wire rather than the Black/red of the other main power supply.

[wilbo666]

The sparky must be a bit of a gimp if he can't check for power at the coils and ignitor. The ignitor is grounded to the block in the loom, the power supply to the coils and ignitor are common and not the same circuit as the injectors and ecu power. Normally it's a black/orange wire rather than the Black/red of the other main power supply.

What he said.


It's grounded via a wire in the loom.

Cheers
Wilbo

[BEVANI]

noted. i shall see on monday how its all going and keep ya posted.

cheers

[Draven]

ps: if your sparky needs your help do diagnose the above, find a new one.

1jz -> ma61 is not a hugely challenging wiring task given the HUGE amount of documentation on the web

[BEVANI]

he knows his stuff... im just trying to get a lil more understanding of the whole situation from other people, posting so it may become helpful to other ppl who may experience these problems and broaden my own knowledge for future reference

on another note....

there is correct voltage going to all the right places but, its either a busted ignitor, ecu, or crank/cam sensor/s
only getting 2 pulse/s out of the injectors then nothing... there is correct voltage going to everything but no signal return(or no signal going out in the first place?) sparky tells me the ecu is doin everything it should be doing so that makes me think it could well be the ignitor... random question. what controls the injector pulse? ecu or ignitor? both? he also mentioned something about on the actual crank (behind the balancer) obviously where the crank angle sensor has its pick up.... something in that area spins freely if the balancer is removed... ive had the balancer off before and never noticed anything to spin "freely" any insight to this?

cheers

[wilbo666]

on another note....

there is correct voltage going to all the right places but, its either a busted ignitor, ecu, or crank/cam sensor/s

only getting 2 pulse/s out of the injectors then nothing... there is correct voltage going to everything but no signal return (or no signal going out in the first place?) sparky tells me the ecu is doin everything it should be doing so that makes me think it could well be the ignitor...

If the engine ECU doesn't see the igniter verification signal for 6 ignition events in a row then it stops injecting fuel. This is why you are only getting 2 injection events.

Anyway "correct voltage going to everything" is not descriptive enough for us to help you I'm afraid.

A checklist such as below would be much more helpful.

• Igniter +12V OK?
• Igniter GND OK?
• Igniter signal wires 1->6 trace back to ECU OK?
• Igniter verification signal wire traces back to ECU OK?
• Coil pack 1->6 +12V OK?
• Coil pack wires 1->6 trace back to igniter OK?

random question. what controls the injector pulse? ecu or ignitor? both?

ECU only. However it will cut fuel if it detects no ignition events from the igniter (See above).

he also mentioned something about on the actual crank (behind the balancer) obviously where the crank angle sensor has its pick up.... something in that area spins freely if the balancer is removed... ive had the balancer off before and never noticed anything to spin "freely" any insight to this?

cheers

Some people have had the crank sensor trigger wheel come loose from the back of the timing belt drive pulley, however given that you have injection events I wouldn't think this would be the case... (in that case you would expect no crank signal and hence no ignition)

You can see the toothed wheel I am talking about in the below picture taken from barned01's thread here http://www.toymods.net/forums/showth...ighlight=crank



Cheers
Wilbo

[BEVANI]

i see. so the part that the sensor pics up is attached to the timing belt cog. if this was to be out of alignment would this cause the injectors to stop firing?

[wilbo666]

i see. so the part that the sensor pics up is attached to the timing belt cog. if this was to be out of alignment would this cause the injectors to stop firing?

*sigh*
I've given you a very good reason that the injectors stop firing.

A reason that is 100% linked to your other problem - lack of spark.



You think that the crank angle trigger wheel is out of alignment enough to cause two fuel injection events yet not out of alignment enough to not to cause zero? By all means check it... but I'd be surprised, and I'd be looking at a wiring issue related to the igniter way ahead of that.

Your sparky should have a CRO with which he can use to check the crank angle sensor signal anyway very easily. Maybe you should get him to show you for your own knowledge.


Cheers
Wilbo

[Draven]

^^
AGree with Wilbo. A munted crank trigger would be a highly unusual cause of the problem you're describing. Check the stuff likely to cause it first