22r rebuild problem

**soulfire** · 11-03-2009, 07:53 PM

Hey guys

I've finally gotten my 22r with twin carbs started. However I'm facing quite a large problem.
When I was cranking it to get oil pressure nothing really registered, but oil was definately getting into the oil filter / oil cooler etc.

However, when I start the car and get it running, no pressure still registers, and it instantly starts POURING oil out from the rear main seal?!?!?

I've seated the rear main seal as per instructions in the FSM, but I am stumped? Motor is going to have to come out again for a 3rd time now. I just can't get how it is escaping?

Everything is brand new in the motor.. it's really frustrating!

Any help would be greatly appreciated!

Adam

**2jzhilux** · 11-03-2009, 07:56 PM

are you sure its from the rear main seal
Has the half moon at the rear of the head (rocker cover) been fitted ,easy mistake to make

**soulfire** · 11-03-2009, 08:05 PM

definately sure its from the rear main dude

my bellhousing is filled with engine oil

this happened the first time, so i've re-seated the seal and it's happened again
i'm stumped

**cambelt** · 11-03-2009, 10:40 PM

Sounds like the oil gallery plug at the rear of the motor has been left out when the motor was built . Just pull the box out , easy.
Dave

**soulfire** · 12-03-2009, 08:18 AM

nope

everything inspected the first time after taking the box out

everything is installed, oil gallery plug is installed at the rear

definately leaking from the rear main

**mudgutts** · 13-03-2009, 06:08 AM

first, have you grounded the oil sender wire to see if the guage is working?

second, for the oil to pump out the rear seal like that, sounds like a blockage somewhere. did you check your oil channels for flow while the motor was apart?
if it's getting through the filter, is it getting to the rockers? try cranking it with the valve cover off to see.
new bearings installed where the oil ports don't match up? head gasket sealent used that might have blocked oil channels?

**soulfire** · 13-03-2009, 09:43 AM

using a aftermarket mechanical gauge, it will read pressure without any electrical help

i don't believe it's blocked, but I will be checking galleries on the weekend. I've got a brand new oil seal, and im going to use some permatex on the outside rim of the oil seal when installing, i reckon when I pull out the motor again, the rear main seal would have unseated itself the tiniest bit... (again)

bearings were all installed and were checked to make sure everything lined up (first engine rebuild i've done, so i wanted to make sure I did everything by the book...)

it does get through the filter, it fills it up, it also is going through my oil cooler as well!

head is getting heaps of oil, as when i took off the rocker cover last time, everything was nice and oiled.

But thanks for your advice, I will be checking over these things again. To see if I have missed something minor! Oh, and i've used an OEM headgasket, no sealant used between the head and the block...

I will let everyone know how it goes.

Cheers
adam

**allencr** · 13-03-2009, 04:00 PM

Originally Posted by soulfire

POURING oil
my bellhousing is filled with engine oil
...this happened the first time, so i've re-seated the seal and it's happened again
...going to use some permatex on the outside rim of the oil seal

'POURING oil' & 'bellhousing filled' doesn't sound like something that can be cured with a gasket cement/Permatex that can only take care of minor surface imperfections and nothing more then .001in, only stuff that would be described as weeping or slowly seeping, not pouring.
The oil seal has actually moved out of place? These seals aren't designed to hold any real pressure, only a few PSI of crankcase pressure from blow-by and that's it, so it would easily be forced out by 50+PSI of oil pressure, the kind of pressure that it should never ever experience.
You've assembled something very wrong and/or its drain/s have been blocked off and until you figure it out, doing the same thing will continue to have the same result.

**soulfire** · 13-03-2009, 04:21 PM

I have a feeling there could be a oil passage going straight from the oil filter down into the sump, that is mean to be blocked. It's the first thing I'll be checking when I remove the motor tomorrow morning.

I do realise that the sump is not mean to be pressurised, and after doing a bit of research, it sounds like it is being pressurised.

I will be changing the rear oil seal anyway. But there are a few things I have to check.

Will let everyone knows how it goes.

Thanks for your response allan!

**o_man_ra23** · 13-03-2009, 04:28 PM

I'll have a look at the engine block pullapart over the weekend and see if I can find anything which might do what you are describing. When you re-installed the rear main seal, did you remove the sump and the rear mainseal housing?? Or just pry the seal out with the crank in place?? The latter should never be performed.

Check the crank where the oil seal mates and see if there is a groove. If so, maybe you should think about putting the seal in so that it is hanging out a mm from where it should seat, thus moving the wear point on the crank to fresh metal.

Good luck with finding the cause. When you get it out, put up some photos so we can try and help you more.

**soulfire** · 13-03-2009, 04:36 PM

I didn't remove the sump no. I am guilty of that much!

This time however I am pulling the sump off first and then the rear oil seal.
The crank looks fine, it looks like a groove line has started, so I will try my best to seat it away from that.

After being told that there is a oil gallery that needs to be blocked in the block that gives a straight shot to the sump, I am almost certain I have forgotten to plug this up (oh well, still new to this engine rebuilding stuff!)

However if this isn't the case, I am going to have to dig a bit deeper and maybe even remove the head to make sure the galleries aren't blocked (block was acid dipped and cleaned, so I would assume all the passages are unblocked)

Thanks for everyones help thus far!

**allencr** · 13-03-2009, 05:32 PM

Originally Posted by soulfire

maybe even remove the head to make sure the galleries aren't blocked (block was acid dipped and cleaned, so I would assume all the passages are unblocked)

What galleries in the head, the drain/s return/s? You wrote that 'head is getting heaps of oil', so if it hasn't overflowed out the filler, it's OK and couldn't contribute to pushing that seal out of place anyway
The block cleaning would have removed all plugs, threaded or pressed and one might have been missed, but I think that sort of thing would leak so much that the head wouldn't have gotten any oil at all.

Flywheel bolts need sealant?
Has an extra seal been stuffed into it, blocking the rear main's drain?

**soulfire** · 13-03-2009, 05:53 PM

Flywheel bolts are ARP and ARP thread sealant has been utilised and they torqued to the ARP guidelines!

What do you mean by an extra seal being "stuffed into it"?
I don't quite get that.

Adam

**soulfire** · 14-03-2009, 04:45 PM

oil passage was not blocked off like i thought

blocked it up with a bolt, oil still pisses out the rear main

oil press gauge still not reading ANYTHING but oil is getting everywhere...