Engine conversion into Ra23

[tomvale13]

If he's autistic there's a great chance he is a genius.

[Blue23]

yer i wasnt to sure on the FJ20, as much as i would love to put one in the 23 i thought it might be a bit bigger. i just thought it might be doable seeing as they fit into a Datto 1600. but looking at a Datto they do seem to have a deeper engine bay as well.

i think the SR might be the go, been pricing Half cuts cheapest ive seen is close to $2000 for the lot. so might be a good thought. but as i said she in gettin a tune atm, i just had a massive power loss all of the sudden, and seeing as when i had it in last time it wasnt at 100% performance i thought i better put her in.

just had a call from the lads and they have seem to nut out the problem, wrong sized jets in my carbs, and cam timing was off, so they are working on her now to get her up to scratch, so hears hoping.

[o_man_ra23]

Check out my RA28 thread... 18R-GTE isn't too hard, and should be a heap of fun. I would suggest using a T25 turbo rather than the CT26 I used, as they are a lot easier to find for cheaper. EFI gear you can get for about $300, injectors about $150, MS2 about $400 with loom, wide band ox sensor about $150, I made my manifold for under $200 (including dump pipe), and then you have miscelaneous pipework and an intercooler, plus the fuel system, most of which would need to be done for any other turbo conversion.

Best bang for buck is 1G-GTE, but you then lose the 4cyl. 3S-GTE is my preference (which is what I am using for the RA23)

[SillyCarS]

yeah oman is right, an 18rg with a turbo on it wouldnt be near as hard as the rest

[Smokey228]

The thing about a turbo rg, is that what do you do when things go bang. You gotta start over again to then do it properly... If you got low comp and the fab skills to fit shit, no probs, the turbo rg would be great for 150odd rwkw. But you still cant go past the sr20... With 3071, 1k, computer, 1500, injectors 500. and you have a package that will let you see 200rwkw easily... And reliably, and when things go bang, its a quick 200-500$ fix...

Cheers,
Jase

[o_man_ra23]

Things go bang if you don't do it right the first time. Start with the right package and you won't have a problem. With the higher compression 18R-Gs you would only want a small turbo (heck, maybe try an SC12 or SC14), with a 8.3:1 18R-GUE (like mine) you can wind up the boost fairly safely.

Also make sure you tune properly.

SR20 is cheap, but the gearboxes for them are nasty and snap reasonably easily, then you need a new tailshaft, new gearbox xmember, remake the sump to suit the mid hump, remake the engine mounts, etc etc. Sounds easy till you map it out.

[Blue23]

Have had the thought process of turboing my 18RG, i have read alot about this process and it seems to be a fair task, with the compression ratios if there not right alot of damage can come from it, but i have also thought about going to a Supercharger instead of the turbo woudl that me more along the same lines as the turbo process or could i come accross some more problems with that?

[o_man_ra23]

Good thing about supercharger is your exhaust doesn't change. The rest is pretty much the same, although you do need to make a mount for the supercharger and line the belt up exactly. Oh, and you need to add a gimble(sp?) drive to the front pulley.

Compression won't stop you getting good performance with a turbo. It will stop you running big boost though. A small turbo on a high compression engine will give great low and mid range torque, which is fantastic for acceleration off the mark, out of corners, lack of lag, and burnouts/drift. It's a great all rounder, but requires tighter control on the tune. There is NO reason a 9.7:1 18R-G with EFI, a small turbo and a good tune can't push out the same numbers up top as an 8.3:1 18R-GUE with EFI, a bigger turbo and average tune... and the higher compression engine will do it with more down low too.

[Blue23]

so you reckon turbo 18RG would be a good goer?

where could i pick the EFI system for the 18RG? thye dont still make them? how much do you think it would set me back?

[Blue23]

Check out my RA28 thread... 18R-GTE isn't too hard, and should be a heap of fun. I would suggest using a T25 turbo rather than the CT26 I used, as they are a lot easier to find for cheaper. EFI gear you can get for about $300, injectors about $150, MS2 about $400 with loom, wide band ox sensor about $150, I made my manifold for under $200 (including dump pipe), and then you have miscelaneous pipework and an intercooler, plus the fuel system, most of which would need to be done for any other turbo conversion.

Best bang for buck is 1G-GTE, but you then lose the 4cyl. 3S-GTE is my preference (which is what I am using for the RA23)

o_man_ra23 - how did yours come along? have you finished it yet any finished pics? i have thought about turboing my 18RG but always thought i was a bit pricey for the effort but if it worth doing i may as well.

[YLD-16L]

SR20 is cheap, but the gearboxes for them are nasty and snap reasonably easily, then you need a new tailshaft, new gearbox xmember, remake the sump to suit the mid hump, remake the engine mounts, etc etc. Sounds easy till you map it out.

The S13/14 series gearboxes shift better than most comparable boxes of that vintage and better than some new vehicles so I don't know where that is coming from? Sure a worn poorly maintained gearbox of any sort will be crap though. As for strength, they're plenty strong unless you plan to run massive power, big slicks and do lots of side stepping the clutch at the drags.

If he went SR20 surely it'd be easier to source a TA23 crossmember than mod anything on the sump.

Blue23, there is/was a place out in Qbn called Ceasers Smash Palace, it is/was owned by the scabbiest c#nt you'll ever come across. He had a massive shed full of Toyota gear a while ago including a few EFI equipped 18RG's. They're probably still there if he is still open becuase he charges rediculous prices so never sells anything. Check it out if you need the EFI gear.


Don't be deterred from choosing an engine based simply on the fact it'll need custom engine mounts as it's one of the simplest parts of an engine conversion process and doesn't take much time to do right.

Also factor in how cheap and readily available certain engine parts are over others when making your decision.

Don't waste your time on shitbox manifolds either if you go for the turbo 18RG option as it'll just give you grief and cost you more in the long run. Get one made well the first time.

[Smokey228]

Im sorry to say this, but im so against the turbo 18rg... Im sure good results can be had! But with an SR20 much better results can be had...

If you only want 150rwkw and never ever want more, maybe an 18rg on low comp with a bit of boost will work with some conservative driving etc. But eventualy the diff will go and you'll upgrade, then the gearbox will go and you'll upgrade.. The fuel system will be done with engine, as will fuel lines, wiring etc, the gearbox will be done with gearbox upgrade, and then eventualy the engine will just die in the ass, cause it was never designed to do any of the things you are trying...

Now if you just use the SR20 from the start, a motor built to be raped and turbo'd! A motor proven time and time again to do great things, you can rule that out as an issue. And 150rwkw is not a great big ask either...

And i know that the s15 gearboxes are renoun for breaking, but from memory the s14 boxes are tough as! And quite often the s15 box is downgraded to an s14 box for that extra strength... But if its such an issue, im 100% sure there are affordable options to make it a bit tougher! Editor of Zoom, PJ, runs a straight cut gear set in his 10second s13 with i beleive an s14 box...? ANd i've seen how he drives, and if it lives up to his abuse, im pretty sure it will live up to anything you can put through it!

This is how i see it;

Engine w/ Box and wiring etc 1500-2k
Brakes front and rear 1k
diff 1k
xmembers 1k
fuel system 1k
wiring 1k
engineering 1k

Thats an incredibly expensive quote, and i'd say most of it could be done under it, i paid someone to do all that for me, and it came quite a fair bit under that for alot of it. Some a bit over...

On a budget?

engine gearbox around 1500
xmembers if you can weld or no someone who can and you line it all up? $150
diff pay a pro 1k
tailshaft 500
fuel skip surge and pickup, skip lines and just get a vlturbo pump 150
wiring if you can do it yourself 200?
brakes, shouldnt skimp but 200
engineering <1k

Win..?

Cheers,
Jase

Oh, cooler and exhaust in any conversion is a must! And if you wanna do it on a budget, like im about to take on, buy some donuts, cut them to your required size etc, mark where you want straights etc to be welded and take them down to your local!
Pipe is going to be bought for around 200$ welding can be done for a carton of beer and 100$ polish will be a couple hours hard work...

Silicon is 50$ a peice... Talk to RiceBurna about that *free sponsor plug* lol

Cheers,
Jase

[o_man_ra23]

Coming along well, but the engine is not complete yet. It will be months before it runs, due to me re-painting the car at the same time. The engine has not had all it's assembly done, I have cut 3 of the 8 ports (cleaning out the casting imperfections, not opening them up). From the EFI set, all you really need is the plenum, runners, throttle body, thermostat lower housing and fuel rail. All the rest you can get later model parts and bolt them in. I used Honda turbo injectors out of an American Honda Talon. Got new plugs for them too. ECU I used a MegaSquirt 2, and I bought the loom for it too. It has onboard MAP sensor, so no AFM needed, and also does ignition control, so no ignitor needed. I need to lock my dizzy, and add the Reluctor sensor from a 22R-E dizzy, but that's nothing that hasn't been done before. Good idea to replace the fuel pressure regulator, original is a bit iffy. You don't need the cold start injector, that can be blocked off, and it has an idle up solenoid for cold starting/air con which the MS2 can control. This solenoid is bolted to the runners. Exhaust manifold and dump I made myself, pics in my thread. Pipe work and intercooler I haven't started yet. Oxygen sensor is aftermarket, coolant temp sensor will also be replaced with a pair of OEM equivalents.

Keep an eye on my thread as there has been some progress, just need to find the time to add the pics.

[Blue23]

thanks YDL-16L appreciate the comments.

yer i am going to get everything done correctly the first time, im not the tye to do something dodge then fix it later, aint my style.

im still tossing up on ideas, this isnt gonna happen for a while, just gettin a few ideas as to where i can head.

[o_man_ra23]

As for the gearboxes:
I know plenty of people who snap boxes behind SR20s (even more behind EJ20s, but that's a different box). W50 will wear out and eat 5th, so they need to be babied in 5th, but the rest of the ratios are tougher than most other boxes of a similar size. W5x is a further upgrade, which requires modifying the gearbox xmember, but they have better ratios, are lighter, and are tougher again than the W50.

Diff is a non-event, it would need an upgrade anyway if you want to lay down serious power.

not looking for rediculous amounts of power but something fun and that i tweak with a bit.

That kind of tells me the power restriction of the 18R-G shouldn't be much of a worry. Doing the 18R-GTE way will teach you a lot about turbos, efi etc and how it all works, which will better your understanding of what to do to get serious power out of a different motor later. If you don't want the learning and just want skids, then SR20 will give more skids (as mentioned). Also, once turbo'd, an 18R-G doesn't have to rev as high as it used to pre-turbo, so some of the internal stresses will actually be lower (while others will be higher).

Up to you what you want to do. TA23 xmember is a good idea... but you have to wait a while to find one, or be lucky that one is for sale when you want it.