car seems slower after manual conversion

[VasH]

Hey all, so i finally finished my manual conversion over the weekend and after taking it for a spin it feels slower than before just doesn't accelerate i think i had one good experience where it just went really well but haven't seen much of that happen again.

Under boost it just doest seem to go anywhere and its working a lot, its hard to say if the clutch is slipping because its not really showing the signs of slippage. It does seem to have like a flat spot, not spluttering but say your going along at a steady 60kmh you go to accelerate the revs don't change much and it sorta feels like your slowing down then it catches up and starts accelerating

Is there anything that i might need to bypass seeming its still has the auto ecu, ive noticed the overdrive light flashes and ive got my check engine light on which i still need to check the code for.

The only other thing i can think off is the twin plate clutch i have is just too much for it? if a clutch can actually make it slower i dont know The engine is fairly stock apart from a little more boost. Im considering doing away with the clutch just coz its a bit insane for street use

If it was the clutch, does anyone know if exedy do flywheels for 1g's id probably go for one of there heavy duty singles. id just need a flywheel.

thanks!

[Kyosho]

You'll probably need to replace the ECU, OR trick it into thinking you're in Drive for instance, and put a resistance across the solenoid pins so it has something to "drive"

[Hengsta]

Just keep the twin plate in there for now and use it all up.

although you will need to wear the clutch back in.

It should feel faster since its manual and you can do sick skids and shit now.

Fix up the engine check light and see how it goes.

[Mos]

say your going along at a steady 60kmh you go to accelerate the revs don't change much

You can't expect the revs to go up - they're a fixed ratio to your speed. Auto the revs will climb in a WOT application, and possibly boost will build faster. With a manual unless you drop down a gear you wont feel that same push.
What gear are you doing this 60km/h in?

and it sorta feels like your slowing down then it catches up and starts accelerating

That could be an accelerator enrichment thing not working properly, so it does sounds weird, but it should've also happened with the auto.

Is there anything that i might need to bypass seeming its still has the auto ecu, ive noticed the overdrive light flashes and ive got my check engine light on which i still need to check the code for.

That shouldn't affect it - check the codes but engines with a lot of crap missing still make decent power.

The only other thing i can think off is the twin plate clutch i have is just too much for it?

What's too much for it? A clutch connects the engine to the transmission.... There's nothing in it to be "too much" for it...

Mos.

[jimmmayyy]

check for vacuum leaks, and take the handbrake off, lol. jks

[Z2TT]

I have experienced the exact same thing vash, I drove a GZ20 Soarer that was converted to a manual and it felt more sluggish than my Auto. Just like you said under boost it seems like its going nowhere.

There is something weird about these Manual conversions with GZ20's, i just dont know why though, is it something to do with it being a Auto ECU? What would the difference be with an auto ecu and a manual ecu.

in the auto ECU it controlls both the transmission and engine, so if you drop a manual in it maybe its confusing the ECU or something, just a thought.

Seems to be something nobody knows about.

[amichie]

You can't expect the revs to go up - they're a fixed ratio to your speed. Auto the revs will climb in a WOT application, and possibly boost will build faster. With a manual unless you drop down a gear you wont feel that same push.
What gear are you doing this 60km/h in?


Mos.

This makes sense.

What about the torque multiplication from the torque converter. It may be givving you a bit more punch until the revs build up also.

[VasH]

Mos - Its a hard one too explain its like changing into top gear when your doing 40 the cars just not gonna go anywhere but im in 2nd or 3rd, The experience is alot like my old cortina which wasnt manual but when it changed up gear it just went no where revs stayed the same so did the speed even though your foot was down until you took your foot off the back on again would it go normally. Later i found that my distributor was the problem as it was rebuilt after i put another one in it never happened again. The only similiar thing i noticed when my soarer was auto is similiar to the issue i had with my cortina but it made a loud ticking/grinding noise until you backed off and accelerated again

As for the clutch being too much, i guess im just still getting used to it the car seems to bog down a fair bit on take off i know they are ment to grab really well i guess i expected more acceleration out of it, i changed the oil again last night to something a little thinner improved shifting heaps but not too much on the acceleration side.

The gearbox also makes a whining noise in 1st 2nd and 3rd, 4th its dead quite, 5th you can sorta hear it i was told it might be the throw out bearing but wouldnt it be noisy all the time?

Another thing would the idle need to be raised to say 1000, instead of 600ish due to being an ex-auto?

thanks for all the help guys!

[Hengsta]

You suppose to rev it abit before you let go off the clutch so you wont stall it.

The rev is fine 600ish is perfect.

[Kyosho]

You're running a light weight flywheel, on a twin plate. You will have to get used to the fact that just as you start to engage the clutch, the throttle needs more go to keep the revs up. This is purely because the flywheel has less momentum to hold the engine revs up as it engages.
Sitting in neutral, my skyline with a lightweight flywheel (4.3KG over 9odd KG IIRC) will drop around 100RPM just from letting the clutch out. In neutral...

Do what I mentioned in my first post regarding the solenoids. The ECU has NFI where the auto has gone, and is tripping out. I will nearly 100% guarantee, your ECU will throw a code relating to the auto, and it will most likely be in a form of limp home mode. My old VR did the exact same thing when it went from Auto to Manual. Either do that, or change ECUs.

[evers]

If it was the clutch, does anyone know if exedy do flywheels for 1g's id probably go for one of there heavy duty singles. id just need a flywheel.

thanks!

Just get it machined i got mine done for 50 bucks when i got my heavy duty clutch, yeah i also found that when im about the release the clutch if i havent already started accelerating its pretty laggy and shit

[JZA70R_92]

AUTO or Manuel ECU wont make a differance with the 1G ive tried both. It could be that your used to the AUTO.....also did you unplug the ecu, battery etc as i notice when i do that with mine it runs shitty for awhile, trying to relearn. the flashing OD light is nothing to worry about. mine flashed for ages until i got a manuel ECU. do you know anybody else with a 1G manuel car to compare?

[VasH]

Hengsta - Yea i have driven manuals before lol i just figured most of em idled higher than the stock auto setting

Kyosho - ill have a look into it but as ga70h_92 said i shouldnt have to play with it. I will look into the codes and see what needs to be done thanks for the info though i might give it a try anyway too see what happens

GA70H_92 - Yea i am used to the auto i also have driven alot of manuals including ones with similiar clutches i guess my expectations where a little too high lol. I didnt unplug it the first time around but i did reset the ecu later on to see what would happen, i didnt notice much change though. If i knew someone with one id definatly be interested to see what the difference would be

thanks for all the help though guys i think i will give it a week or so to get used to it and check out the diag codes. and see what happens from there

[Smokey228]

I have a Auto 1JZ sitting infront of my Twin Plate R154, stock everything bar exhaust and cooler. It makes 195rwkw and the Moroso calculations...

So Auto ECU wont affect the running of the manual 1jz...

Cheers,
jase

[Mos]

What about the torque multiplication from the torque converter. It may be givving you a bit more punch until the revs build up also.

That's part of what I'm getting at - when you plant the gas in an auto, the revs will always go up, up to a point at which the torque converter starts limiting those revs. This has the double effect of multiplying torque and putting the engine into a higher rev range where it's making more torque.
In a manual obviously the revs will only rise as your speed rises.

Mos - Its a hard one too explain its like changing into top gear when your doing 40 the cars just not gonna go anywhere but im in 2nd or 3rd,

I can't explain the hesitation, maybe it wasn't as noticeable with the auto... in any case I doubt it has anything to do with the box. It might be something that inadvertently happened while the box was being installed, but it's not something normal for a manual 1G with an auto ECU.

The gearbox also makes a whining noise in 1st 2nd and 3rd, 4th its dead quite, 5th you can sorta hear it i was told it might be the throw out bearing but wouldnt it be noisy all the time?

That's most likely something to do with the layshaft. 4th gear does not use any gears inside the gearbox - it effectively connects the input shaft with the output shaft, applying no thrust loads on the shafts or bearings.

Do what I mentioned in my first post regarding the solenoids.

Have you actually done this to back up your suggestion?

The ECU has NFI where the auto has gone, and is tripping out.

Yes, it does have NFI, but no, it's not tripping out - it doesn't care.

I will nearly 100% guarantee, your ECU will throw a code relating to the auto,

You don't need to "nearly" guarantee - it will happen.

and it will most likely be in a form of limp home mode.

No, it won't. The transmission will be, but the transmission ECU and engine ECU are separate devices in the one case.
There are many documented cases where it has been shown that an auto 1G-GTE runs without any signs of distress without the transmission connected.

My old VR did the exact same thing when it went from Auto to Manual. Either do that, or change ECUs.

Have you seen this behaviour on a 1GGTE toyota ECU that you have been able to correct by the corrective action you're suggesting?

Mos.