The Spray Painting Thread

[DoctorDubb]

Just a quick questions, ive just bought my compressor ...yes its cheap...$275 for a 2.75Hp belt drive, 50ltr tank, supposively 250l/min FAD (310/min displacement) and more importantly its 10 amp as i do not just have the money for a 15 amp supply. Sounds good then ill tell you its from Super Cheap Anyway..

Ive read through this thread, but i am going to run air tools as well as a HVLP gun. Ive picked up a 30m cable, but in the instructions for the air rachet etc it has an inline oiler. Now i have this bit included in the set (clear piece with a fill hole and what looks like a bleed into the line) is this correct? So it shows that i should set it up Compressor (regulator etc) -> Oiler -> 30m Cable -> Air tool. Wont this introduce oil into the line when it comes to spray painting ill be stuffed? I was thinking Compressor -> 30m Cable -> Oiler -> 1m Cable -> Tool - but this would require me to buy another 1m cable which i havent seen around much? Any ways around this?

Secondly im looking into a HVLP for ~$100 (student on a budget - i know its not much), anyone in WA know besides the usual Malz, Bunnings, Few Paint Stores in Balcatta, Super Crap, Repco.. etc. Or any brands in this price range i should be looking out for?

[hu5tln]

Just a quick questions, ive just bought my compressor ...yes its cheap...$275 for a 2.75Hp belt drive, 50ltr tank, supposively 250l/min FAD (310/min displacement) and more importantly its 10 amp as i do not just have the money for a 15 amp supply. Sounds good then ill tell you its from Super Cheap Anyway..

Ive read through this thread, but i am going to run air tools as well as a HVLP gun. Ive picked up a 30m cable, but in the instructions for the air rachet etc it has an inline oiler. Now i have this bit included in the set (clear piece with a fill hole and what looks like a bleed into the line) is this correct? So it shows that i should set it up Compressor (regulator etc) -> Oiler -> 30m Cable -> Air tool. Wont this introduce oil into the line when it comes to spray painting ill be stuffed? I was thinking Compressor -> 30m Cable -> Oiler -> 1m Cable -> Tool - but this would require me to buy another 1m cable which i havent seen around much? Any ways around this?

Secondly im looking into a HVLP for ~$100 (student on a budget - i know its not much), anyone in WA know besides the usual Malz, Bunnings, Few Paint Stores in Balcatta, Super Crap, Repco.. etc. Or any brands in this price range i should be looking out for?

hey buddy, as i am a spraypainter by trade i'll help you out abit, you can get away without usin an oil running on your line, all you need to do is put 2 drops of oil in the bottom of you tools whenevr you use them and that keeps them lubed up fine, however in saying that, dont oil you your spray gun, and point two, as for a spray gun around 100$, you wont find much quality, but then again i'd take it you are only doin a few odd jobs and a cheaper one will be fine, around 100 or just over look for the brand stan, they are a rather cheaper gun but still paint fine, just ask if you need anymore help,cheers kern

[hu5tln]

OOPS, yeah thinners on a cloth, and some very fine steel wool, sometimes a scraper blade will mar the glass.

cheers Chuck.

be careful using steel wool as you have more chance scratching the glass, use a double edge razor blade on a 45degree angle and this will remove any overspray from glass without any trouble

[-Totenkopf-]

Don't get a HVLP gun, especially not on a small compressor. Just get a reduced pressure gravity feed gun.

["Z" UTE]

35 hours of prep, and I have finally managed to get some etch primer onto 2 guards, 2 doors, and a bonnet. At the going hourly rate for a paint shop, that as a shit load of dollars saved.

cheers Chuck.

[love ke70]

you can run 15amp compressors on 10 amp supplies. just change the plug.

dont bother with the inline oiler, just put some air tool oil in your tools that need lubing every so often, often less is more. too much oil and you start blowing seals and the tools get gummed up with dust and crap.

[TERRA Operative]

you can run 15amp compressors on 10 amp supplies. just change the plug.

Please don't advise on flat out illegal and dangerous practices.

Ever.

[o_man_ra23]

you can run 15amp compressors on 10 amp supplies. just change the plug.

Besides being illegal, this is just stupid. Quite simply, the larger compressor will happily run all day every day on a 10A line IF it didn't need to start, AND you didn't have anything else running on it.

Standard 10A circuits use a 2.5mm^2 cable, which in most household/shed installations will give you about 20A of current to play with, so that's fine. Unfortunately most sheds that don't have a 15A circuit designed into it often have a little 2.5mm^2 cable leading out from the switchboard to the shed, to feed both the lighting and general power. This long skinny cable means you get a LOT of voltage drop on startup. That voltage drop then causes the current to spike higher in your compressor, and will not only burn out the compressor quickly, but also everything else running in your shed.

Also, the switch on the wall that your compressor is running on is designed to withstand the current spike generated of switching off (or breaking the circuit of) a compressor with a full load current of 10A. A compressor with a higher full load current could weld the contacts of a 10A switched plug together, which leads not only to a fooked switch, but also it could be dangerous if the pressure cutoff switch on your compressor fails.

In saying all that, my 2.5hp 50L twin piston belt drive Puma compressor keeps up with my gravity feed gun over an entire car. Takes about a minute max after spraying the entire car to get to cutout pressure.

Also, I have had my supercheap air tool kit for about 5 years or more. The line oiler broke about 4.5 years ago. All the tools are still very serviceable, nothing other than the usual supercrap wear, and the rattle gun and air chisel have copped a hiding. Just put a bit of engine oil into the air feed of the tool before use, and during prolonged use. The condensation in the compressed air milks up the oil a bit (I haven't made a full on humidity remover yet... it's on my to do list), but hasn't stuffed anything yet. Kinda waiting on them to break to give me an opportunity to buy good ones.

SO I REPEAT... DO NOT PUT A 10A PLUG ON A 15A AIR COMPRESSOR... this may work ok with welders should you dial them down a bit (my welder came with a 10A lead, and recommends replacing with a 15A lead if you want to crank it), but for an induction motor load, you will run into problems, and not just legal ones!!

[love ke70]

compressors have a startup capacitorm, which turns to smoke if theres too much load on startup.
but for what its worth, i can run 10 fluros in my shed, a small 2.5hp compressor and the 3 HP 15amp compressor all at the same time, not worrying about what kicks in when.

and yes, this shed is fed by a 2.5mm wire running 20+metres from the MSB.

and i never advised it, i just said it could be done, and how, my boss ran this compressor on worksites for 6 yrs before giving it to me as he blew another capacitor onsite, due to sharing power across 6 jobs off the one switchboard. so he bought a smaller compressor. he only replaced the motor once, and thats just coz it got tired, not because the world ended like you guys are implying will happen.

so in short, make your own decisions, but dont lecture me about things you havnt done. if you do the maths, a 3hp compressor can legally run on a 10amp supply, but as you said, with nothing else on the supply.

but practically, alot more than that can be done, safety margins are there to be exploited

[TERRA Operative]

but practically, alot more than that can be done, safety margins are there to be exploited

Um, no they're not. They're there to protect personel and property.

I wasn't going to -ve rep, but the fact that you have continued spouting this dangerous advice has changed my mind.

[o_man_ra23]

so in short, make your own decisions, but dont lecture me about things you havnt done. if you do the maths, a 3hp compressor can legally run on a 10amp supply, but as you said, with nothing else on the supply.

but practically, alot more than that can be done, safety margins are there to be exploited

I didn't lecture you on anything I haven't done. I have done the math. Capacitors are to compensate for the massive induction and help reduce induction spikes on switch off, but they are not the be all to end all, and after the compressor has been off for a short time they do nothing but increase startup current (as they have to be charged on startup).

Safety margins are there, as mentioned by TERRA, to protect people and property. Do you know what your insurance company would do to you if they found you deliberately overloaded your shed after a fire started due to a melted switch?? They would laugh at you while the courts prosecuted you possibly for arson.

What electrical qualifications do you or your boss have??

[love ke70]

its been tagged by my sparkie mate
and when my boss used it he never had a problem getting it tagged through genuine test and tag companies.
im not saying to go out and do it, but im saying the possibilty exists if the need arrises.
so having done the math, you would know that a single 3hp compressor draws 2200 watts and a 240v system can supply 2400 watts so it legally isnt as issue if thats all your running.

i ran the two compressors in tandem for about 6 hours on day while sanding my car, giving them short breaks to cool down, and never had an issue.

but hey, on toymods technicalities rule over practicalities, and you can blow your neg reps out your arse, i couldnt give a shit

anyway, i dindt make the original statement to get into an arguement about it.

i agree its not a recommended practice, and your never going to agree its a safe practice, so lets say we drop it here?

[o_man_ra23]

you can run 15amp compressors on 10 amp supplies. just change the plug.

anyway, i dindt make the original statement to get into an arguement about it.

What did you make the original statement for?? It's not about full load current, there is also voltage drop and transients to worry about. These are BIG issues.

Test and Tag looks ONLY at serviceability. They will perform an earth leakage test, a conductor resistance test, an insulation test and they will look for physical signs of unserviceability like nicks in the cable, bent plugs etc. Other than that, I really doubt any of the registered test and tag companies would look at the motor rating unless it looked SERIOUSLY oversized, as motor housing sizes vary quite dramatically over different brands for the same output rating. Test and Tag also does not look at the fixed wiring within the establishment. And from the way you give it a toasting, I am surprised it hasn't burned through yet. Have you ever seen a wire eat through it's insulation because there is too much current running through it?? I have, and the fire afterwards wasn't fun either.

Could you give me your sparkie mate's electrical license number?? He won't be a sparkie for much longer if he is passing off things like that knowing that the plug has been changed. What you have done IS legally an issue, and any attempt to justify it being otherwise is just foolheartyness.

Technicalities might rule over practicalities on Toymods, but Legalities rule over all else in the electrical world. Every rule in the electrical book is based on safety or practical limits (plus a safety margin), and almost all of them because somebody blew something up or fried somebody by being stupid. Do you want to join them??

[TERRA Operative]

I didn't lecture you on anything I haven't done. I have done the math. Capacitors are to compensate for the massive induction and help reduce induction spikes on switch off, but they are not the be all to end all, and after the compressor has been off for a short time they do nothing but increase startup current (as they have to be charged on startup).

Also to provide the phase shift in the waveform to allow the motor to rotate, 3 phase motors don't need them as the waveform is shifted by 120deg already.

[o_man_ra23]

Ah yes, of course, it will give you a phase lead, giving the motor direction when put between the positives of 2 pairs of windings. If it is used for the phase lead though, it will do nothing to reduce induction spike on switch off, so my previous statement supporting the use of the capacitor to reduce current in any way shape or form was incorrect... there is ZERO benefit in the way of current reduction by having the capacitor. So you will still get that massive blue spark through your switch when you turn it off (which wears out the contacts, and can fuse them together in an extreme case)