2 stage injection on the beams motor now with pics

[Celica RA45]

been working on this slowly over easter to run 2 stage fuel injection .run the inboards up to 3500 rpm and then have the new out boards taking over up to 8800 rpm red line .the idea was to run 440cc in the std position and also 200mm further up the inlet track another set of 440cc injectors .
so what i have come up with was buying some TODA parts that bolt onto the quads that also have injector bungs in them ,then modifying the TRD trumpets to bolt onto the ae101 extensions, bore these out to 50mm, make up a fuel rail and make it all happen .ok finished it, then 2 work out the fuel ,so i ended up running fuel to the new rail,. coming out the end to go to the old rail and then to reg and back to the tank. after a few leakes and some new washers fixed all the leakes
dyno day well we started a run 1st to make sure of what we had and also since i have again changed the inlet track from 195mm long to 225mm long and also to make sure of no leakes .had a few drips and also to take off the air box incase of fires etc
we started with 179 kws at back wheels then we configured the new soft ware for the out boards as this is std on the m800 ,it has 8 injector drivers as std
then we played around with 60 % and 40% on the new 1s till we moved them up to 10% in and 90% out power has jumped up to 188 kws but we are getting stand off from 6500 rpm to 8800 rpm .changed injector timming up and down to stop the stand off ,in the end we came up with 40% in and 60% out to stop most of the stand off but also to satop any fires i might get running it around the track
the next stage is putting in some 720cc denso injectors which are single pintle ,not a V pintle like the 440 cc and try this also might change the inlet and exhaust cam timming to fix the stand off
with the 2stage i have increased my power all of the way through the rev range from 4000 rpm up to 8000 rpm and im talking about 10 to 15kws in certain points .
at 4000 rpm i use to have 56 kws and a big flat spot to 5000 rpm now i have 80 kws at 4000 and it runs flat then up to 5000
ok 4000 rpm 64 new is 80kws 7000 158 new 162kws
5000 rpm 98 new 108 kws 8000 170 new 176kws
6000 rpm 135 new 143 kws 8400 172 new 180 kws
so this is where im at ,for the time being

[ViPeR_NiPPleX]

sounds very impressive Glen, what is 'stand off' though?

i'm suprised how big a difference the distance of injectors makes to midrange power... better atomised fuel when it reaches the valve i'm guessing

[Billzilla]

sounds very impressive Glen, what is 'stand off' though?

i'm suprised how big a difference the distance of injectors makes to midrange power... better atomised fuel when it reaches the valve i'm guessing

Stand-off is where you get fuel fogging coming out of the inlet trumpets.

My racer used to have a fuel fog about 8cm long at times, then we made some changes and the fogging stops right on the end of the inlet.
Stuff like cam timing, injector timing, etc, can all affect it.

[horse]

did a quick graph in excel for easier viewing

nice work with the 2 stage

[mrshin]

You mention longer trumpets - wouldn't these also be somewhat responsible for the lower down increases, and also maybe hurting the final top end figure a bit? I'd love to see you break 200, even just so you can tell everyone you did it!

[gianttomato]

Glenn sent me some pics and asked me to post them up. Click to make bigger - you know the drill.

All enclosed within the airbox.


Top's off!




Dyno graph - dark line represents two stage injection and red represents single stage with injectors in the standard position. Whilst the ultimate power looks the same, there have been gains in the midrange and the tune was backed off due to excess standoff - they did see 189 rwkW but it was felt too dangerous to continue. Anyway, I'm not his apologist so he can do all the splainin'!


Gratuitous speedo and tacho pic....both arms sweep deep into the right down the main straight at Phillip Island!


Hope you find these handy.

[thechuckster]

glenn: are the injectors doing one shot per cylinder per 720 cycle (e.g. fully sequential) - with each firing based on cam position and injector phasing settings?

btw: great looking setup - much like the Cosworth engine that Nero featured in a recent Race magazine.

Also - can you phase in the 2nd staged units, e.g. so they're only firing at higher rpms or air flows? this seemed to be what they did with the cosworth.

fwiw: the megasquirt way of doing this is to have a fuel map for each injector bank (they have to run in batch mode as there's only 2 drivers in the MS ECU). The upside of two maps is that you can change the mix of inner & outer injectors depending on a number of vars (usually rpm & map or rpm & tps plus a few other logic switches like coolant or some physical switches).

[brett_celicacoupe]

a video with quality sound of the dyno would be awesome to see.

love the zip ties though

[Celica RA45]

zip ties are there incase the 4 posts break and fuel spews every where, will keep it together ,well we hope any how

[86er]

wow that is just great stuff, Im convinced that u will eventually go over 200kw at wheels. Im watching this for further development with 720cc injectors

[rolleraction]

LURVE your work Glenno. (As usual)

PS

VVTiiVittIvv (whatever is is nowadays) still connected?

Steve

[Mooro]

That is an awesome piece of machinery...I'm in awe.

To break 200rwkws would just be crazy stuff for a naturally aspirated 2L. From looking at the power delivery of that thing it is pretty savage when it comes on cam...much like a big turbo coming on boost I guess. Is it a bit of a handful on the track or is it fairly easy to keep it in the power band with the 6 speed?

[gianttomato]

Glenn spammed my mailbox with more pics. Uploaded for your consumption.

Pics of new setup.

[gianttomato]

More




And 2 pics of the dry sump arrangement.

[roadsailing]

did you consider aiming them directly into the trumpet instead of through the runner wall?

or did you just run out of room

also, have you played with inlet length much?

looks good!