3SGTE oil pumps.

[strat]

Hi all, i am looking for a oil pump to suit a mid 92 to oct 93 SW20 GEN 2 SW20 3SGTE, the problem is i need more psi and toyota say that the N/A and turbo pumps are the same. my question is. Is there any other pump in another gen 3S that would fit and make more oil psi? The part number for the pump i have is 1510088382. And no im not going to go in the dry sump direction!

[af300e]

I'm not sure that any of them produce more pressure as the relief valves are what controls this and I'm pretty sure they's all be the same. The 5s pump will deliver a little more flow than even a gen 3 pump because the rotor in it is about one mm wider. I have the part number for this pump at home (I bought one to change the filter position on my gen 3). One way to change more the pressure would be to put a smaller pulley on the pump, but again the relief valve will pop-off when it reaches a certain pressure.

Why do you need more pressure anyway?

[Joshstix]

Putting a smaller pulley from a Gen 3 will spin it harder to move more volume. You can pull apart the relief valve and shim the spring to increase the pressure it will hold.

Can I ask what you need more pressure for?

[CLG]

or simply install a late model 5S oil pump?!

[Joshstix]

The late model 5S pump is higher volume but the spring is the same as teh old pumps as far as I know, so still gives the same pressure.

[strat]

Its in a rwd race car aplication and i only have 25psi, not thats it been a major problem as i have run on this psi all last year. To get it to 25psi i have had to shim up the spring with washers and the first meet this year the relif spring fell out in qualifing, lucky i caught the problem in time and shut it down. just saved the motor.

[Joshstix]

So at revs it only gets to 25psi?

That sounds a bit concerning. How loose are the bearing slearances etc? Are you running oil squirters? Where are you getting the pressure reading from?

The wierd thing is that increasing the spring pressure for the relief valve increased the pressure you're getting which means you were already getting enough pressure to open the relief valve. I'd expect if you could only get a very low pressure then the relief valve wouldn't have been opening.

If you are getting the pressure from the stock location you need to take into account that it is at the end of the chain. The oil has already gone past all of hte pressure drops in the system before getting to the pressure sender, unlike say a 4A which has the sender right after the pump.

[off-road]

The gen 4? NA motor has a better pump to drive the variable cam timing.You have to use the 2 piece sump to fit it to a gen 2 though. I have the complete set up (ie pump and 2 piece sump.)
PM me if you are interested in it.

[strat]

Yep 25psi @ full revs. Guage is at the stock location at the top of the head which i understand is the lowest psi point. I have a low psi lite of 15psi at the remote oil filter, on high G corners i can get the lite to come on. Bearing clearence i am unsure of but had a rebuild last year and all bearings are std size. This problem has had myself and my tuner stumped all last year.

[Celica RA45]

strat you need to put the oil pressure near the oil filter to get the right pressure ,by the time the oil has got up near the head the pressure is fairly low any way
just use either st185 turbo oil pump or get the last camry 1 that has tthe steel sump has the same oil volume as the altezza 1
also do you run a remote oil cooler ,if you do tap into there for the oil pressure and that should give you more higher pressure
the altezza 1 is near the oil filter on the sump pan and they block off the 1 in the head
the head 1 is only used in the fwd for the toyota oil pressure guage

[2jzhilux]

Does this model 3sgte come with balance shafts and if so have they been removed and the oil feed hole not blocked?25 psi is bad at full revs. Surprised your motor has lasted this long.

[The Real Roadrunner]

my old 3s had the oil pressure guage in the back of the head and it would sit on 65-80psi when driven hard so i have to call bullshit on the low pressure point bit.

25psi at max revs would = a dead motor very quickly so im suprised yours is still alive.
fit a brand new oil pump or relief valve and if your bearings are clearanced correctly it should sit at over 50 at full noise depending on what type of oil you use.

2jzhilux, none of the 3sgte's had balance shaft afaik so that would only be a problem if it was built using a 5S block.

cheers
linden

[strat]

my old 3s had the oil pressure guage in the back of the head and it would sit on 65-80psi when driven hard so i have to call bullshit on the low pressure point bit.

25psi at max revs would = a dead motor very quickly so im suprised yours is still alive.
fit a brand new oil pump or relief valve and if your bearings are clearanced correctly it should sit at over 50 at full noise depending on what type of oil you use.

2jzhilux, none of the 3sgte's had balance shaft afaik so that would only be a problem if it was built using a 5S block.

cheers
linden

Yes i am with yo 100%! I canot belive this motor has run a whole season + on this pressure with it being only raced hard! i run penrite HP50 25W60 this has been the best oil out of three that i have tryed. I have never used a brand new oil pump so i think i will give that a go. the oil psi will sit on 50 psi when cold as expected but once a heat cycle has gone thruogh the oil 50 does not hang around for long. I think this motor is a proof of how strong the mighty toyota really is.

[Joshstix]

What sort of pressure do you have at idle? I believe the BGB lists minimum pressure at the stock sensor location as really low, les than 5psi low.

[oldcorollas]

stupid question.... is your oil pressure gauge farked?

the other thing is.. oil pumps have no troubel making pressure. they are positive displacement with a fairly incompressible fluid,
so your problem is either relief valve bleeding off oil volume, or big clearances bleeding off the volume..
so either fix the relief, fix the clearances, or go for more volume.

is it possible to manually pressurise the pump with engine off? and then see where all the oil is pissing out from?

[rolleraction]

I say stuffed guage or blockage as no way your motor would survive race conditions for a season on 25 psi at full revs (especially if you;ve increased compression and you are reving the nuts off it).

Rellocate pressure feed or have guage checked or both. Also, the stock location in the head results in a delay of the oil guage indicating pressure at start up (ie from cold)
The delay can be disconcerting as oil warning light stays of for longer than necessary and you worry for a sec that all is ok. Also when you blip the throttle, the delay with the oil gauge 'catching up' is annoying....

As Glenn said, move the feed near the filter (remote mounted or otherwise) and you get a better and more responsive reading

[Celica RA45]

also not to burst your bubble linden most of the new motors as in altezza have a oil restriction built into the head gasket so from 6mm into 2.5 mm for the head

fwiw i use to put a 2mm oil restriction plug into the back oil gallery on the gen 2 motor and was using a mechanical oil pressure guage on head and on the oil remoter filter there is something like a 30 psi difference on a std motor

also if you go up to the 5s block you will have to remote oil feed the vvti as the 3s altezza blocks are unique with the extra oil gallery to feed the vvti and also for the oil return on the cyl head back to the block as well

[strat]

Firstly i have 50 psi @ idle when cold and goes to 60 @ revs. 20 @ idle when hot and goes to 25 30ish @ revs. I have tryed swaping my warning lite and guage around with minimal results. My warning lite is located on the remote oil filter inbetween the oil cooler and block. All guages are brand new Auto Meter. Tonite i am going to try removing the oil cooler and running it stock style with filter mounted on the block. I have a feeling that it is the oil cooler causing the problems as it is a crapy masive oil cooler with more mods done to it than Michael Jacksons face! ill keep yall posted. cheers for all this help i wanna get this problem sorted before i go to Eastern Creek.

[oldcorollas]

is it a full flow or bypass cooler?

[strat]

is it a full flow or bypass cooler?

Im not to sure its a modified RX7 S4 cooler im in the process of removing it now, just had to have a break before i start braking things