5ME - no power ( less than usual :oP )

[WA_TRD_83]

Hey guys..

here's one for you Toymods nuts with a bit of 5M experience under your hats..

5ME motor, auto gearbox. 380,000kms

Symptoms:
Foot flat to the floor.. no power.
The car moves.. but struggles to move.. very very very very (etc etc) slow acceleration. yes I know that the 5M is not a huge power plant - but this is just abnormally slow. Throttle response is almost non existant.
Will sometime spit and cough and miss if I keep punching the accelerator.

What we know so far:
Engine idles smoothly.
Checked compression - perfect in each cylinder.
Checked for BHG with sniffer - no BHG
Leads look good, maybe even new/replaced (one still had the barcode sticker on it).
Pulled the plugs, a couple of dirty ones, but not enough to restrict the power this much.
Timing has been advanced.. no change in power... timing has been retarded.. no change in power..
All fluids have been checked and ok.

Diagnosis:
Dunno... bit of a head scratcher..
hoping someone can shed some light on what else to check and change to get some power / response while I've got a few 5M's laying around I can take bits from..


Thanks for your help guys.. Hope someone can diagnose the problem.

Damo
[TRD 83]

[Norbie]

Back to basics - fuel and spark! Check the resistance of the plug wires with a multimeter. Try throwing in another set of plugs if you have some spares lying around (or can borrow some).

On the fuel side, check for possible air leaks post-AFM as this could throw your AFR's way out of whack. You could also be running out of fuel (dodgy pump/filter), so if you can get hold of a fuel pressure gauge that would be handy.

[jonra23]

What does the exhaust sound like, collapsed muffler or cat?
Intake track /air cleaner all clear?

regards
jon.

[tooch]

Have you checked the TPS? Not sure if it would cause these symptoms if it was busted or way off adjustment, but its worth checking.

[Robbos_Toyotas]

wilbo and i had this exact same problem with our 5ms making no power, it turned out to be the air-bypass valve, an ugly looking thing with rubber hoses attached near the intake plenum. Get me a pic of a 5m and ill try to explain further. cost like $5 from a wrecker or $250 from toyota and i dare say will fix your problem.

Blake

[WA_TRD_83]

wilbo and i had this exact same problem with our 5ms making no power, it turned out to be the air-bypass valve, an ugly looking thing with rubber hoses attached near the intake plenum. Get me a pic of a 5m and ill try to explain further. cost like $5 from a wrecker or $250 from toyota and i dare say will fix your problem.

Blake

as I say - I've got a couple of 5M's around - so I should be able to yoink one from somewhere..

see if you can see the air-bypass valve in here?



Cheers
Damo

[Robbos_Toyotas]

that thing that attaches via a rubber hose to the intake pipe, that looks like its sitting on the thermostat housing. the half black thing with the 2nd hose going into the top of the plenum
blake

[WA_TRD_83]

also - thanks to Norbie and jonra23

Plugs could be an issue, as we swapped a couple around and that seemed to clear up the rough idol it had - but didn't fix the lack of power.
Might pay to change them and/or the leads.
Fueling is another possibility as the car has been sitting for a while .. but I've since put fresh fuel in and some injector cleaner..

Car runs no cat, but does have 3 mufflers.. I'm about to replace the rear one so I'll see if that changes things at all.
but the air cleaner / intake looks new and is certainly drawing in a lot of air..

Damo

[Robbos_Toyotas]

also - thanks to Norbie and jonra23

Plugs could be an issue, as we swapped a couple around and that seemed to clear up the rough idol it had - but didn't fix the lack of power.
Might pay to change them and/or the leads.
Fueling is another possibility as the car has been sitting for a while .. but I've since put fresh fuel in and some injector cleaner..

Car runs no cat, but does have 3 mufflers.. I'm about to replace the rear one so I'll see if that changes things at all.
but the air cleaner / intake looks new and is certainly drawing in a lot of air..

Damo

change that valve dude, i bet my left nut thats your problem! just need to make sure your spares arent rooted as well, as its a common failure part!

[WA_TRD_83]

nah.. the previous 5M motors ran alright.. just had BHG!! ha

Thanks Robbo..
I'll try that asap.. looks quick and painless enough to change anyways.. so may as well give it a crack.

Damo

[Robbos_Toyotas]

nah.. the previous 5M motors ran alright.. just had BHG!! ha

Thanks Robbo..
I'll try that asap.. looks quick and painless enough to change anyways.. so may as well give it a crack.

Damo

Let us know how you go

[thechuckster]

disconnect the AFM plug, bridge (short) the yellow 2-wire plug right next to the AFM and see if the problem is still present or any worse (if AFM is working, the engine should idle only and stall if throttle opened).

disconnect the TPS plus and see if any different - it provides ECU with signal if throttle is closed (idle) or open (WoT).

check that fuel pressure regulator vacuum line is actually connected.

If problem continues - discard engine and find something better?

cheers,
Charles.

[brett_celicacoupe]

what colour where the plugs when you removed them?

[wilbo666]

I wouldn't suspect the ABV as the engine idles smoothly. The ABV is only for cold start, should have no effect when running, if it is jammed open (unlikely), the engine will idle high, if blocked shut (likely) then it will have no effect!

As it idles well I also wouldn't suspect the Cold Start Injector (CSI) or other injectors are leaking...

I would check for air leaks post AFM, there are a few hoses that could be shagged. If I had a spare AFM I would try that (as well as plugs/leads).

Also check vac advance to the dizzy?

I'd also have a look at the connector to the ECU coolant temp sensor, and perhaps measure the resistance of it...

My bet is air leaks, post AFM....

Cheers
Wilbo

[Robbos_Toyotas]

I wouldn't suspect the ABV as the engine idles smoothly. The ABV is only for cold start, should have no effect when running, if it is jammed open (unlikely), the engine will idle high, if blocked shut (likely) then it will have no effect!

As it idles well I also wouldn't suspect the Cold Start Injector (CSI) or other injectors are leaking...

I would check for air leaks post AFM, there are a few hoses that could be shagged. If I had a spare AFM I would try that (as well as plugs/leads).

Also check vac advance to the dizzy?

I'd also have a look at the connector to the ECU coolant temp sensor, and perhaps measure the resistance of it...

My bet is air leaks, post AFM....

Cheers
Wilbo

Wilbo, my 5m used to idle fine, it was only when you started driving it went like poo and acted like a dead weight...

[EldarO]

from memory, two of the plugs were carboned up, the rest were fine, the thing idled like an 8, plugs were taken out, compression was checked, 175 psi on each cylinder, +/- 5 psi.

plugs were put back in, car was started to do the TK test for BHG, the thing idled alot smoother, as time went on, it got smoother and smoother, byt the time all testing was done, it ran smoother than my 7M.

understandable, i found out that day i have a BHG :/

best of luck fixing it damo.

Eldar.O.

[ViPeR_NiPPleX]

the only time I had a 5m-e act like that was when it was on the cold side and the earthing was bad. The thing would idle ok-ish, as soon as you tried to put any boot in, the thing would belch black smoke like mad, although you couldn't see it in the rear vision mirror, had to follow from behind to see.

check piping between afm->t/b could be hidden cracks esp under the exhaust manifold.

good luck

James.

[WA_TRD_83]

If problem continues - discard engine and find something better?

cheers,
Charles.

hahahaha - Thanks Charles..
yeah, its on the cards - but not in the budget at the moment.. so have to get the 5M drivable for now..

Thanks guys.. will follow up on suggestions..

Damo

[CrUZida]

Go with what Viper said, Stitty had the same problem.

Make sure the block, head and body are all properly earthed to the battery.
Make sure the ignitor is properly earthed too.

Bad earth means the spark blows out under load.

[WA_TRD_83]

change that valve dude, i bet my left nut thats your problem! just need to make sure your spares arent rooted as well, as its a common failure part!

Blake.. you owe me your left nut!
I only had a small time frame to play last night so I changed that air bypass valve as described. No change whatsoever..
Dam - I was hoping for the quick fix.

I've had a few people now suggest the ignition side of things.. so I'll next change all the plugs, leads, coil, ignitor etc (when I have some time).. see if that helps..

cheers guys, will keep you updated
Damo