7K-E Oil Recommendation

[Dom-AE71]

Hi everyone.

Been a while since I last posted! I haven't owned a Toyota in quite a while which is part of the reason why!

Anyway to the point. - Here is some background info

6 months ago I purchased a 2000 Toyota Townace 7K-E with about 184000kms on the clock.

I've done a few oil changes since buying it and have been using 5w30 Fully Synthetic Oil.

The oil was recommended by the guys at Burson as being best for how I use my car.

I daily drive through Sydneys crap traffic and on weekends I'm on the highway up and down the coast chasing the surf, so I wanted something that would be good under longer driving, higher RPM speeds etc

Anyway initially it was great with the first change and the engine at 100kms/hr was much quieter and felt like had less strain, so I can only assume there was thicker oil in there previously.

The problem I've had the last few months, is under load (mainly in 4th and 5th gear) at low RPM the engine is making a rattle. I've run some Lifter treatment in the engine, firstly just a little bit I left over which almost completely got rid of the rattle, but after a few hundred kms it came back again (not worse just the same as before)

Now I've spoken to a number of mechanics including Toyota who have all told me different things, just wanted to bounce it off the Toymods Knowledge base to see what direction to head in to get rid of the issue.

Toyota said they use 10w30 Semi Synthetic magnetic - now based on seizing a motor after doing 4000kms on magnetic (literally separated and ran dry) I wont ever use Castrol again no matter how much anyone bangs on about. I also guess Toyota use this because its cheap as piss and high margin. He did mention running a 10w40 might cause the engine damage, but not sure what kind of damage he could mean?

Another mechanic said to run in 0w20 as the oil will be thinner and be able to get into the lifters properly and eliminate the noise

Another mechanic said to run 20w50 as it will increase the oil pressure.

Car engine is actually pretty good and doesnt leak any oil. Starts first time and idles/revs smoothly other than the noise in 4th/5th gear.

If anyone has an suggestions?

Im currently using Nulon and was planning on using Penrite 5w40 in my next oil change, looking for anyone elses thoughts on the matter.

Also of all the mechanics I took it to about the noise, not one of them thought it was an issue with the lifters, some said gearbox, others have said clutch, so its hard to believe what they say. It wasn't until I chucked in the lifter treatment that I did some research about it and realised thats most likely the issue.

[oldcorollas]

K engines generally want something like 20W50, or maybe 10W40.. the hydraulic lifters of 5 and 7K may want something different tho..
I would have thought 30 would be a bit thin? sure it will slightly reduce friction at sustained high rpm.. but you're not revving to 8grand?


if it is noise in 4th and 5th gear, under load at low rpm. are you sure it's not just pinging?

why not try a cheap 10W40 next, see how it goes, then a cheap 20W50 and see the difference..

K motors are not exactly high tech, and I can't why you'd want a 5W in there... the oil warms up quick enough, and then you are well away from the cold viscosity..

which lifter treatment and what is in it? is it just cleaners and viscosity modifier?

maybe the lifters are just stuffed?

should be reasonably easy to get them out after pulling off the rocker cover...

[Dom-AE71]

I don't think it is pinging (unless it is slightly which is part of a combination of problems) as when I run the treatment it goes away.

The stuff I used is NULON LIFTER FREE & TUNE UP 300ML.

Description:

Quietens noisy hydraulic lifters/cam followers
Suitable for all petrol, diesel & LPG engines
Cleans oil galleys in hydraulic lifters
Removes sludge & soft carbon
Frees up sticky lifters
Will not affect oil viscosity

Spoke with a different mechanic at Toyota (seemed to know what car I was talking about this time) he said standard they come with 20w50 in the 7KE from factory so I will just go back to that with my next change and see what difference it makes.

Worst case scenario if there is damage to the lifters they are only $8.50 each so I can change them all over when I get the chance to do it.

[trdee]

i dont really have anything to add except to say WOW i can't believe toyota was still building K-motors into the year 2000 :O

[Hiro]

i dont really have anything to add except to say WOW i can't believe toyota was still building K-motors into the year 2000 :O

Not just 2000, it lasted until 2003 in the Townace, and lasted even longer in their forklift range (you can still buy a Toyota forklift brand new with a 4Y as well)

[Xauterus]

You can't fix worn lifters with treatment. It only delays their replacement.

[oldcorollas]

i dont really have anything to add except to say WOW i can't believe toyota was still building K-motors into the year 2000 :O

good for... EFI manifolds for the previous 35 years of K motors

[Dom-AE71]

I'm weighing up whether to change the lifters myself or get a workshop to do it but I'm worried because the 2 I spoke to have been pretty vauge. One couldn't even give me a quote and the other said it'll take minimum 4 hours of labour which I think is BS. It seems pretty straight forward to me, I know I need a special tool to get the lifters in and out (eBay sell them for $25) other than unbolting the rocker cover and the rocker arm, do I need to re torque everything back down to a specific setting? Can't find a workshop manual for the 7ke anywhere which is really frustrating

[oldcorollas]

I'd imagine torque values will be ballpark with the 5KE?

or http://www.rollaclub.com/wiki/index....eries/EFI#7K-E

https://www.scribd.com/doc/160076270...air-Manual-pdf

[Juggernaut]

Hi guys,Im sorry to disturb you but im very new one to this forum,and im interested in some kind of things in my car and i dont know how to open the new Thread in forum,so if anyone could help me,i would be very glad thanks in advance

[allencr]

The problem I've had the last few months, is under load (mainly in 4th and 5th gear) at low RPM the engine is making a rattle. I've run some Lifter treatment in the engine, firstly just a little bit I left over which almost completely got rid of the rattle, but after a few hundred kms it came back again (not worse just the same as before)

OK, that isn't a lubrication or oil spec or brand problem, (It would be Very Difficult for you to find any lube that isn't OK for it!!!!) just a WAG. The thin snake oil/additive/miracle in a bottle may loosen& remove sludge, but valve lifters don't seem to get enough flow to benefit very often and they also don't know whether the it is in 1st, 5th or heavy loaded, and any valve noise can be replicated just reving at stand still to get the exact same reaction, they are only affected by RPM & heat, not load or gear.
Loose heat shield, AC clutch, vibrating brake line, whatever is most likely.
Detonation/pinging/pinking/spark knock, like marbles rattling in a tin can, is dumb.
Good luck.

[Dom-AE71]

Thanks for the reply Allen, it's a bit hard to ascertain exactly what your comments and suggestions mean but ill have a crack.

The clutch fan is faulty, it runs constantly and when cold. It's worth while changing that anyway (booked in for Thursday as I can't be bothered doing it myself) I've already had the engine exhaust manifold removed and re-installed and that helped removed some engine noise but not the problem I am having. The most puzzling and contradiction to what you have said is that the engine noise went away when I ran a lifter treatment in the engine, then came back again over time. I don't see how a clutch fan could make noise then stop making noise after adding that. Anyway, I don't think it's the clutch fun but it needs replacing so it's not a waste of time doing it.

I'm honestly blown away that for what I thought was such a simple motor that everyone has so much trouble diagnosing what the issue is with it

Also with regards to lifters not knowing the difference between 1st and 5th gear, I assume an engine would experience different load bearings depending on gear ratio? 4th gear is 1 to 1 meaning the lowest loading through the transmission, wouldn't that then mean the highest load trough the engine when compared to 1st gear? Or am I looking at it the wrong way?

Is there anything else that is "most likely" as everyone that looks at the car says it's transmission straight away

Old corollas, thanks for the workshop manual link, ill have a look through tonight

[allencr]

AC compressor's electro-magnetic clutch. When not engaged, many will vibrate & rattle at unique rpm's or ranges.
Wrong way, yes. While the valve train is part of the engine, it is simply being turned and is not affected by engine loador gear, only speed & heat, and would sound exactly the same going down hill in gear outa gas with the ignition off.

[Dom-AE71]

Quick update: replaced L&Rhs rack ends & passenger wheel bearing and clutch fan, didnt fix anything. Next step possibly waterpump but so far $500 wasted and still rattling and clunking. Anyone want to buy a townace?

[oldcorollas]

Also with regards to lifters not knowing the difference between 1st and 5th gear, I assume an engine would experience different load bearings depending on gear ratio? 4th gear is 1 to 1 meaning the lowest loading through the transmission, wouldn't that then mean the highest load trough the engine when compared to 1st gear? Or am I looking at it the wrong way?

the load on the lifters and valve gear ONLY changes with RPM. how much gas there is in cylinder won't really affect the load experienced by valve gear or lifters

"load" as in gearing and throttle, will change what is seen by the pistons, rods, crank, clutch, transmission etc...
but things like valve gear, alternator, water pump etc, and "hangers on".. their load doesn't change with gear.

can you take video/record sound of the rattle?

the snake-oil thickeners more likely to temporarily stop big end rattle? or maybe decrease volume of big end rattle due to detonation at higher load?