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Thread: 2AZFE into AE86

  1. #1
    Junior Member Backyard Mechanic
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    Default 2AZFE into AE86

    Hi members.

    Im new here.
    Im fitting a 2002 Toyota Camry 2azfe into my AE86 Aussie delivered shell.

    I just joined up to share my work on this project and to look for some bits I need for it. Ive been driving a 20v AE71 for about 5 years now, so I am looking to have something with more power under me. I love instant throttle response. The idea with the 2azfe engine is to have an angry high comp engine with itbs and grunty cams so that whenever I need to explode forwards its just a tickle of the throttle away. I like to maintain the character of the original chassis which is known to be a great handler, so the exciting thing about the 2az is the light weight. It will weigh less than a 4age 20v engine package when I am done. The engine is a little lighter by itself. Its a great way to pick up 800ccs and no weight penalty.


    The specification when complete will be as follows:

    Shell:
    Rust repaired
    Flared to suit 15x8.5 neg offset wheels. Most likely Southern Ways or Fins.
    Glass Bonnet - Modified D MAX
    Glass Hatch
    Poly rear window
    Minimal Interior

    Driveline:
    2002 2azfe engine - new
    Custom 11:1 Pistons - Carillo standard bore.
    Standard cams and retain vvti
    Silvertop ITBs on custom manifold with 95mm custom trumpets.
    Custom headers
    Adaptronic select ECU and custom wiring
    last gen celica radiator and fans
    W57 from an T142 Rona
    Brass shifter rebuild
    2azfe std clutch (9 inch I think)
    Custom tailshaft
    Mark 2 Rona diff - 7.5 inch
    Lexus Altezza torsen LSD centre - low miles. 3.9 ratio.

    Custom work:
    The fabrication required has been limited to Engine mounts, inlet manifold, Trumpets, Gearbox crossmember, some cooling pipes, a radiator cowl, and just a tickle of a firewall mod at the lower corner where the tunnel meets the firewall. I am using a hybrid starter that is half EP82 starlet and half 4age 20v as thats what fits. The bellhousing is a modified Y series housing from a van. Its modified in that it has been drilled here and there for extra bolts. I have tapped threads in the block for engine mounts, and for the bell housing to bolt up to. Once it comes apart for final assembly then I will have a little extra aluminium tigged around some of the holes in the BH to allow a stronger union. I have physically cut a releif in the alloy sandwich plate area at the gearbox union to allow fitment of a conventional starter in the place that the Y BH has it. It misses all the important bits out there under the inlet. I use the natural slanted left angle of the engine as it mates to the BH so I can have a massive straight shot inlet and make the starter miss the steering. In the sump, I have extended the oil pickup to the new lowest point with a flanged mild steel extension. I am yet to reposition the drain bung but thats a small thing anyhow. The standard sump can be used and is quite slim, it just needs the bung moved. The standard sump can be removed and replaced easily while the motor is in the car.

    Issues:
    The issues along the way were finding a starter that fits, and the overall height of it even with the left slant. Belt tension was difficult but not too hard once I gave it some serious effort. I just modified the stock idler carrier type tensioner to allow more movement and then I fitted a mechanical threaded adjuster like some alternators have to adjust it. Easy.

    This is how it looks right now. If you would like photos of any particular aspect, just let me know.










    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by LittleRedSpirit; 05-11-2012 at 10:51 PM.

  2. #2
    Junior Member Backyard Mechanic
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    Default Re: 2AZFE into AE86








  3. #3
    Junior Member Too Much Toyota oldcorollas's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2AZFE into AE86

    that's a lot of effort!
    Good work so far
    "I'm a Teaspoon, not a mechanic"
    "There is hardly anything in the world that a man can not make a little worse and sell a little cheaper" - John Ruskin (1819 - 1900)

    AU$TRALIA... come and stay and PAY and PAY!!! The moral high horse of the world!

  4. #4
    Junior Member Backyard Mechanic
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    Default Re: 2AZFE into AE86

    Thanks. I guess your seeing about 2 years condensed into 2 posts.

  5. #5
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    Default Re: 2AZFE into AE86

    A bit of technical info on how I made my inlet.:

    I've tried to design my 2az manifold to give balanced performance but specifically to peak its efficiency at 6500rpm. The injectors in the head that shoot right at the valve will be good for efficiency, but I may look at introducing a different fuel or fuel source further up the inlet some day. The engine isn't designed for high rpm like a beams so this may prove unnecessary. I just have to see how it goes.

    On the 2az I ended up going with the butterfly 192mm from the valve top (as its about as close as you can practically make it give or take 10mm), and a total average inlet length of 345mm from the back of the valve. I have about 5 degrees of tilt to bring the throttles down, but you can still clearly see the valves through the trumpet with the butterflies open.

    Also, the length of inlet is related to inlet cam timing, and there are certain guidelines about the inlet length vs rpm and cam timing that you can follow. See the table below.

    My engine with vvti all the way on advancing the inlet cam, it will close at 20 after BDC, which even though there is no line on the table, we can extrapolate as being suitable for around 2000rpm. Then with vvti off allowing the cam profile to shine through and close 60 after bdc, we can see that my length is suitable for around 5000rpm. By reducing the trumpet length I can Push this to a matched length for 6000 or even 7000rpm. I've been after a torque monster type set up with this, hence why my inlet is designed to be most efficient with standard cams and to highlight the peak torque range of the standard power delivery, which is listed as:

    Thanks to Wiki: "Output is 117 to 120 kW at 5600 rpm with 162 lbft (220 Nm) of torque at 4000 rpm"

    Since the 2azfe is a fairly long stroking motor to begin with, I don't intend on rotating it faster. I'm just increasing compression to 11:1 from 9.5 or so, adding itbs and keeping a fairly long inlet that is a little more focussed on the torque than hp output, but with room to tune and adjust.

    My throttles have been spaced apart an extra 10mm over standard because that is the difference in port spacing between a 20v and a 2azfe. This allows me quite a big trumpet bell mouth and still 3-4mm in between each one. I wonder what effect this has. I can try my T3 trumpets as a comparison later I guess. The trumpets are just under 100mm long, maybe 94 or 95mm.

    I found this table useful:
    Curves in inlet ports I believe can help acceleration of the charge (torque) and also help mix the fuel into the air better I thought. I may be wrong but its what I've been told. Playing with where the butterfly and injectors are is also able to change the result. As I understand it, the closer the injectors and butterfly are to the head, the better (more efficiently) the engine will perform at low rps. Conversely, if you move the butterfly and squirter's farther away then you can have a better fuel mix at high rps and a smoother less turbulent air stream. I've tried to design my 2az manifold to give balanced performance but specifically to peak its efficiency at 6500rpm. The injectors in the head that shoot right at the valve will be good for efficiency, but I may look at introducing a different fuel or fuel source further up the inlet some day. The engine isn't designed for high rpm like a beams so this may prove unnecessary. I just have to see how it goes.

    On the 2az, which I know is quite different to a Beams I ended up going with the butterfly 192mm from the valve top (as its about as close as you can practically make it), and a total average inlet length of 345mm from the back of the valve. I have about 5 degrees of tilt to bring the throttles down, but you can still clearly see the valves through the trumpet with the butterflies open.

    Also, the length of inlet and butterfly position are related to inlet cam timing, and there are certain guidelines about the inlet length vs rpm and cam timing that you can follow. See the table below.

    My engine with vvti all the way on advancing the inlet cam will close at 20 after BDC. Even though there is no line on the table, we can extrapolate as being suitable for somewhere around 2000rpm. Then with vvti off allowing the cam profile to shine through and close 60 after bdc, we can see that my length is suitable for around 5000rpm. By reducing the trumpet length I can Push this to a matched length for 6000 or even 7000rpm. I've been after a torque monster type set up with this, hence why my inlet is designed to be most efficient with standard cams and to highlight the peak torque range of the standard power delivery, which is listed as:

    Thanks to Wiki: "Output is 117 to 120 kW at 5600 rpm with 162 lbft (220 Nm) of torque at 4000 rpm"

    Since the 2azfe is a fairly long stroking motor to begin with, I don't intend on rotating it faster. I'm just increasing compression to 11:1 from 9.5 or so, adding itbs and keeping a fairly long inlet that is a little more focussed on the torque than hp output, but with room to tune and adjust.

    My throttles have been spaced apart an extra 10mm over standard because that is the difference in port spacing between a 20v and a 2azfe. This allows me quite a big trumpet bell mouth and still 3-4mm in between each one. I wonder what effect this has. I can try my T3 trumpets as a comparison later I guess. The trumpets are just under 100mm long, maybe 94 or 95mm.

    I found this table useful:

  6. #6
    Junior Member Automotive Encyclopaedia
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    Default Re: 2AZFE into AE86

    Very nice welds, its obviously not your first time ...

    The motor looks a bit long in the tooth on the oil change front, all a bit gummed up in the head departement ..

  7. #7
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    Default Re: 2AZFE into AE86

    I cut and shaped and finished the mounts but my friend the professional welder with 10 years experience did the welds. Mig welds. The manifold is tigged by the gentleman who used to own exotic exhausts here in Brisbane. He is an awesome fellow, and he really liked the inlet design.

    I have 2 motors, one is a dummy fitted dunger purchased from Razorback Sam that I used to do testing and mock it up in the half cut, as I didn't want to have destroyed the brand new 2azfe (pictured with just the manifold on it) if it didnt work out after cutting the block and drilling and tapping things on it.

    Thanks for the reply bud.

  8. #8
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    Default Re: 2AZFE into AE86

    So theres a little bit happening this week on this endeavour.

    Ive had the vaccum ports in the manifold professionally tapped and then had the throttle side faced to remove faint warp-age from the alloy welding. The itbs themselves have now been acid bathed to remove the stains of neglect and time.

    The Corona diff goes to the fabricator tomorrow arvo for the mount changeover, and when thats done Ill drop the whole halfcut in there for the headers to be made. Im looking at utilising a 4-2-1 design to create maximum low to mid rpm torque.

  9. #9
    Jack of all trades Automotive Encyclopaedia mattysshop's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2AZFE into AE86

    where abouts is the fab work getting done? (diff and extractors) are you looking for a tapered merge collector style to get the most out of the 3 pipe intersections?

  10. #10
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    Default Re: 2AZFE into AE86

    Thanks for the reply.

    The fabricator is Rick Sendall. He is not known in Japanese mod circles. He is very capable and skillful. Does almost anything from engine internals to cages and sheetmetal work. He makes very nice extractors, and I believe he will make his own collectors. I intend to use the correct streamlined design of merge collectors (along the lines of burns ss etc) with the appropriate sized aperture according to the pipe size I use for the pre-ceeding sections. The taper isn't as important as the exact sizing of the aperture after the collection from what I can gather, and there is a formula that governs it. Always keen to hear any more theories people have. Every day is a school day. Im using mild steel for them as I want to tone down the raspy sound vvti makes that Stainless would exacerbate.

  11. #11
    how much is Too Much Toyota JustenGT8's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2AZFE into AE86

    Have you checked valve clearances to the higher comp pistons thru the full range of inlet cam timing?
    Lily Simpson 6.7.2010
    R.I.P.

  12. #12
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    Default Re: 2AZFE into AE86

    No I havent, something I need to check. They have some decent flycuts in them but I dont know yet off hand. Not sure if it will be an interference engine or not. I have the faith as the pistons are designed for oversize valves and high lift camshafts.



    Last edited by LittleRedSpirit; 02-08-2012 at 12:02 AM.

  13. #13
    how much is Too Much Toyota JustenGT8's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2AZFE into AE86

    Toyota chain drive DOHC engines are customarily 'interference', as you don't have to worry about snapping belts costing you the entire engine, but can't say i know with a 2AZ? Either way, a dummy assembly, or at least some very careful dial gauge measurement, is called for here
    Lily Simpson 6.7.2010
    R.I.P.

  14. #14
    Junior Member Backyard Mechanic
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    Default Re: 2AZFE into AE86

    Yes, that's correct. I was going to investigate the possibilities once I had them installed, no other way to do it really. I dont know too many people locally who have played with a 2azfe that much, so I have to read second hand info from forums in the US where people are modding Scion TCs. Most of those guys just fit a turbo kit and be done with it.

    When its apart Im going to try to drop in a water jacket spacer around the bores, as they added this part on later 2azfes, I think 2007 onwards. It helps to evenly dissipate heat and stop any hot spots on the cylinder. They also increased the compression to the high 9. range at some point in the build series from what I can gather. So hopefully my 11:1 slugs arent too far out of the ballpark. I hope I can use the whole rang of operation of vvti. I didnt want to lose such a good creator of torque. If I had to compromise too much with the vvti Id most likely go silly and look for some camshafts and upgrade the valve train a bit. This engine is one of the cheapest for performance parts.

  15. #15
    Cressidaspert Carport Converter andrew_mx83's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2AZFE into AE86

    Those pistons are purtty

    Nice project mate, valve interference should be pretty easy to check.... i just stole a tub of playdough from my daughters room haha it works great
    There is no substitute for PUBIC inches

    Never late in an x8

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