levin bzr upgrades

[jacobrjett]

ive got a stock standard BZR at the moment. the engine is going to be rebuilt in the next month or two with silvertop conrods, and maybe ACL race bearings.

the rest is stock. I want to know what experience people have had with camshaft upgrades, with the standard ECU.

so I have a couple questions if anyone would like to answer them

*would i get a performance increase, and what kind if so, if I upgraded to 270ish cams intake and exhaust on standard ECU? (thinking 8.5-9mm lift, i hear the standard springs can handle up to 9.5mm lift)
*i hear cam overlap is good. if 270ish is the limit for standard ECU. what about the exhaust cam? the exhaust cam doesnt effect the ecu right? so what if I ran something like 264/280 ish or 272/288 ish?
*what if I just upgraded the exhaust cam only? if I kept the standard cam on the intake, and ran a 270 ish exhaust cam.
*would running a bigger exhaust cam make the exhaust louder? i like the car to be louder then stock because I think it sounds good and makes it more fun to drive. but I dont like the look of big bores and the like, I actually really like the look of the standard bzr exhaust and its a 2 1/4 inch exhaust so id like to keep that if possible, but id like it to be louder.
*can i get the ECU chipped to raise the limiter to 9000rpm?


i dont really want to upgrade the ECU... i dont want to spend too much as I dont plan on keeping it for ages and i wont get my money back if i invest in full ECU etc.
other plans for the car are
*maybe take the cat off
*headers
*trumpets
*maybe a fibreglass bonnet with an air scoop to help get better air to the trumpets

[TERRA Operative]

What's your budget?

I would start with a nice set of headers (HKS 4-1 racing headers are up at the pinnacle of off the shelf items) coupled with a good straight through 2.5" exhaust and high-flow cat, short trumpets in place of the stock items, if you add a scoop (AE101 GZE style), mod the airbox so the air goes into the top of the airbox straight to the trumpets.

Ceramic coat the pistons and maybe combustion chambers (ceramic coating pistons is cheap) and get the anti-friction coating on the piston skirts too.
I wouldn't go *too* big on the cams, just because of the VVT system. A reasonable increase is ok, and an adjustable cam pulley on the exhaust cam will allow you to play with timing. (remember to reset the base timing on the distributor if you adjust the exhaust cam).

The ECU cannot be chipped, as all Toyota ECU's are software encrypted with CPU level hardware decryption. Aftermarket is the only way if you want any tuneability there.

Hope that helps to get you started.

[Sam_Q]

I am not sure what you mean by "not getting your money back" with an ecu upgrade. How are any of the other mods different?

[BLK_20v]

I have nfi why you wouldn't reuse the blacktop rods....

And the blacktop cams are already pretty agressive, so a bees dick increase in size will be barely noticable... With the 4age there is little point in tickling them up other than a CR raise without swapping for an aftermarket ecu...

[Sam_Q]

Not reusing the blacktop rods makes sense when your going to 8500 regually.

Otherwise I completely agree with your points.

[jacobrjett]

thanks for your input guys

Terra - im not too worried on the budget, i can kind of just buy things as I go. but i want to get as much performance out of the motor I can dollar/torque and horsepower wise.

I mean for an aftermarket ECU, i would be looking at around $2000nzd I guess for a emanage wiring and installed? on top of the cams which I may as well get big cams if im getting aftermarket ECU so would need springs too, that would be $1350 from kelford, then there would be the whole dyno and tuning process on top of that... where on the stock ECU, apart from the bolt on upgrades, I could just get maybe 272 cams because ive seen people run them on the stock ECU before... I just dont know if they run good!

as for the 4-1, thanks for your recommendations I will look into that, I thought 4-2-1 were the best but I will google that as thats probably been hugely covered elsewhere (i couldnt find much info on the questions ive asked here i searched first)

Sam_Q, I know that no upgrades will give you your money back, but im hoping to get as much power as I can with smaller upgrades on this motor as I can. Maybe if I ran a 272/288 cam setup, (does exhaust cam timing effect the ecu?) if that can work with the standard ECU - in the future after ive finished all the bolt ons, and cams, i *might* look into an ECU, but thats a really expensive upgrade, and I want to get as much as I can done without it first, then decide where to go from there


BLK 20v, the rods seem to be the weakest part in the blacktop engine, and I will be swapping them for some bigger stronger silvertop conrods that have done 70,000kms less (i might look at shot peening them) and I intend to go to the rev limiter quite a lot on the car, id like to get it to 9000 but it sounds like i will need an aftermarket ECU for that? also with the cams, i believe the standards are about 250 degrees with 8.2mm lift, but run like a 230 with vvt. i notice a considerable difference going from 230ish to 250 ish with the vvt, wouldnt furthering that to 270ish make a more considerable difference?





im hoping that I am able to do the following
*trumpets with some kind of cold air flow
*extractors
*decat

and then I was thinking of putting a 270 degree exhaust cam on only, with adjustable cam gear.. that, or if someone can confirm how cams run with standard ecu, maybe a 270/288 cam setup (does the exhaust effect the ECU?) ive read that just upping the exhaust cam makes the car perform better, but im wondering if anyone on here could confirm it, or clarify it if its not the case.
also will a bigger exhaust cam make the exhaust louder because the valves are open longer?
I would most likely like to try and keep the stock exhaust apart from a decat and extractors

[TERRA Operative]

4-1 headers will give you a narrow, tall peak in the torque curve at the tuned RPM, 4-2-1 will give you a lower, wider peak. Former for race, latter for street (basically).


Oh, and get the whole lot balanced from crank pulley to flywheel. I got my silvertop balanced to above aerospace specifications (it was 6 grams out in total, one of the best the guy had ever seen, awesome Toyota engineering) for about $180.

[jacobrjett]

how much does balancing generally cost one?

cost is an issue with me... its not that I cant spend a lot of money, its just im a student and I can only pay for stuff as the money comes in, so the more I pay the more I have to wait lol. but I will look into balancing it, and getting the head skimmed etc

[TERRA Operative]

I got my silvertop internals balanced for $180 at Engine & Industrial Balancing Services at 51 Prospect Street, Grange, QLD. Fantastic work and I highly recommend him.

51 Prospect Street, grange - Google Maps

[Sam_Q]

You can do all those mods but although this sounds harsh your just wasting your money. Without the tune your polishing a turd. These ECU's don't give the ignition advance and it just dumps the fuel in after a certain load or revs.

While I can supply cams and trumpets for you no problem the gains are trival.

So how about adaptronic? I hear their cheaper over there than here for some weird reason

[jacobrjett]

allgood doesnt sound harsh mate thats what im here for

if you get a standalone ECU and run it without any other modifications (no exhaust, no cams etc.) does this have any performance benefit?

[Sam_Q]

yes considerable, mostly in the mid range. However it's best to do it all at once so you don't have to tune it twice.

By the way I know someone who fitted high lift cams that where 270/270 with VVT still enabled and it picked up a bit in the mid range and very top, nothing around the 6000rpm mark. I don't think it was worth the money and from what I hear the Kelford cams don't peform that well anyway.

[shrike]

Id go for kelford rally cams or a custom set of 272 with about 8.5-9mm lift its what im looking at