FAQ - National Code of Practice - NCOP Thread

[Fantapants]

Thanks for that. Also managed to stumble on the corrct papers so looks like my project is getting there thumbs up... Thanks mate

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[Fantapants]

Hey guys, apologies if this has been asked and answered already but my searching has resulted in no answers lol.

Under ncop, can we destroke/ reduce bore to get a certain engine in under capacity? Thought being offset grind on a uzfe to drop 130cc...

Proving capacity is easy enough but not sure if this is an acceptable avenue ?

Will check with the engineer Monday, but thought it couldn't hurt to ask while I wait lol?

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[masterofsinanju]

Caveated with the usual "I have no actual authority or specific knowledge", but I doubt that would be approved. I can think of a number of rationales used but essentially, getting an engine in stock form that would be over capacity would leave the engine number approved as part of your engineering certification but then being able to be returned to original capacity with no real way of checking.

I'd love to know if your engineer has a different view (since his/hers it what counts, not mine).

[Fantapants]

Yeah it's very easily got around. But, and I think this is the only thing going for me lol is ncop doesn't seem to stipulate "how" you determine capacity. So they go to pains to explain where you get the weight of the car (must be heaviest tare weight of sedan model sold in Australia) but make no such demands on the capacity of the engine. Only that the capacity must be under the 4x limit.

I have seen various mentions in the Torana world (just through random googling lol) of using destroked engines to get engineered... And it seems fairly common with the LS series of engines to mix and match for various capacity... Unfortunately nothing as small as I need.



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[masterofsinanju]

Ha! Then your interwebz based information is way better than mine (being almost entirely in my own mind).

Very interesting if the torrie folk have success in this area. It would be awesome if it's a goer for you too!

[Fantapants]

Yeah #whoknows

I'm unfortunately very emotionally commited to this #admittedly stupid idea.

I'm slowly coming round to the conclusion it's not gonna happen. But doesn't to know I have exhausted every avenue before I wave the white flag...

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[love ke70]

I know an engineer has recently approved a 1uz in a sprinter, might help your cause a little, I am not sure how it worked but there was some funny numbers involved lol

LS engines come in quite small sizes, I imagine the torana guys would use the small capacity motors and then just do an engine change and update the engine number and happy days, no one knows..

[petergoudie]

You need to look at it pragmatically. That is, an engine is an engine and an engine number just identifies an engine and who owns it. All you should have to do is prove that your engine changes results in a smaller capacity. You need to speak face-to-face with your registration authority and agree on a way for you to prove it such as a set of photos or a stat dec that the stroke or bore has been altered. Think about the 4afe and 7afe stock Toyota engines. The 7 has an enlarged bore and stroke on basically the same block. If Toyota wanted to do the same thing as you and keep the same engine number series do you think that all registration authorities in Australia would refuse to register its vehicles. All you need to do is to get into and agreement with your Authority and its records will show the old engine number now has a smaller engine capacity or possibly they will issue you a new engine number.

[Fantapants]

Essentially that's the argument I'm going with.

Unless the engineer has better ideas, I have offered to have the engine bottom end verified (stroke and piston calculations) and then a video of the swept volume test performed after the engine is installed. This would visually confirm capacity, engine number and vehicle ...

Everything I have managed to read I interpret as you have, that
the actual capacity of the engine is the important bit, NOT the original factory capacity. #shrugs. I'll call the ginger beer shortly.

If he thinks it might fly then he will contact the regulators and get the go ahead.



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[trdee]

pretty sure the torrie guys use blocks from smaller LS motors?

[Fantapants]

Yeah smallest I have seen in ls is 4.8

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[petergoudie]

(1) You should go and talk to your registration Authority first. Be polite and tell everything truthfully. Show you are genuinely trying to do the right thing.
(2) After I wrote the post above I thought of another example. When the Group A V8s introduced a new rule of 5 litre maximum, GMH were using the Australian 307cuin engine of 5030cc capacity. GMH had to lower the capacity and I think the 304 was born with a marginally reduced stroke.

[Fantapants]

So I'll get some written confirmation but as far as engineer is concerned, reduced capacity is totally OK. He has to physically confirm the reduction with bore and stroke confirmation during build. But he agrees that the rules only state the physical capacity and make no mention of maintianing factory designated capacity.

So it's a win. I'm lookong for pistons off the shelf, but it's not looking great. So custom pistons will most likely sit in a resleaved block with stock rod and stroke. It's only a small reduction in capacity, so we can possibly get it back with a bit of compression. But if it's lost its lost. #stillsoundbogan lol thanks for all the help guys. I'll try and keep my build thread updated for anyone interested

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