Modifying vehicles

**eeeyan** · 08-10-2010, 11:11 AM

My boss reckons now that there are new restraint laws coming in that regardless of the era or registration of the car lap-sash a.k.a "modern" style seat belts are now mandatory for any car being driven on public roads.

He of course didnt supply me with any references only that the new laws mean the old lap belts are no longer legal at all.

**river** · 08-10-2010, 11:16 AM

Hi,

Originally Posted by oldcorollas

River, surely you can only customise it to the extent of whatver was available at time of manufacture as sold IN AUS??? or as complied when imported?
JDM (or USDM) has no relation to ADM, apart from some romantic notion that "era corect" means "japan correct"

For an Aussie delivered RA28 (for example) yes. For JDM import like the RA25, then it can be configured to JDM specs of the time, so long as it remains on historic plates.

That's why I can have fender mirrors on The 88 and Al Palmer can have them on his TE27 and OSJ can have them on his RT Corona.

Now, I just rang and spoke to the NSW Conditional Registry division about this. They said the historic registration says the vehicle needs to be "as built" and any period accessories are allowed. However, this applies to locally built cars. So, if a Toyota was made in Australia (some models were made in Oz for a while) and it came out of the Aussie factory with full ADR at the time, then putting JDM accessories on that car are not deemed period accessories, as these were not local accessories - no matter what accessories etc its JDM built version had.

However, if the car was a special import or a mass import (like the Celica) then you can put period JDM accessories on the vehicle for historic registration.

They said it is a grey area and said a mass import vehicle,. such as an RA28, can be fitted with period JDM accessories and placed onto historic registration at the discretion of the owner, with agreeance from the car clubs committee and in doign so does not make the vehicle invlaid for historic registration. That is, the RTA isn't going to take your rego off you for putting something like fender mirrors on your LT RA28 - so long as it's on historic plates.

But, if you bought an Aussie built Corona, then you cannot put JDM accessories on it.

Does that make sense?

seeyuzz
river

**Supra1978** · 08-10-2010, 11:34 AM

On fender mirrors: I don't think the addition of fender mirrors is such an issue, but more so the deletion/removal of a compliant RHS external mirror.

**Farkurnell** · 08-10-2010, 11:34 AM

Originally Posted by oldcorollas

I think you may be fined for having passengers in the back with no rear belts, and although you could argue that they are not required, if it went to court the argument would be that the passengers were endangered but not having belts etc etc...

So I don't have to have the rear seatbelts because the car's didn't come out with them but I just can't carry people in the back?

Originally Posted by river

For an Aussie delivered RA28 (for example) yes. For JDM import like the RA25, then it can be configured to JDM specs of the time, so long as it remains on historic plates.

That's why I can have fender mirrors on The 88 and Al Palmer can have them on his TE27 and OSJ can have them on his RT Corona.

River, you keep qualifying statements with reference to them being on historics but what about normal rego's? I mean the fender mirrors on the RS41 are period accessories that I put on. They were sold in the 60's so are they Kosher to have on now?

**RONA** · 08-10-2010, 11:40 AM

Originally Posted by Farkurnell

So I don't have to have the rear seatbelts because the car's didn't come out with them but I just can't carry people in the back?

It is perfectly legal. My mates EJ had no rear belts we'd go lapping the city with 6 ppl on board no rear belts, cops would shake their heads but they can't fine you for it.

**river** · 08-10-2010, 11:49 AM

Hi,

Farky.. I don't know the answer to that. It depends on what year the ADR came out regarding fender mirrors. I am more conversant with historic rego.

Does anyone know what ADR refers to fender mirrors?

seeyuzz
river

**Hiro** · 08-10-2010, 11:51 AM

Originally Posted by Farkurnell

So I don't have to have the rear seatbelts because the car's didn't come out with them but I just can't carry people in the back?

See what I posted above - the law is that you must use a seatbelt if one is is fitted for your seating position - whether or not it legally has to be fitted there is dependent on the year of manufacture of the car and the relevant design rules/regulations of that time.

**Supra1978** · 08-10-2010, 12:09 PM

Originally Posted by river

Hi,

Farky.. I don't know the answer to that. It depends on what year the ADR came out regarding fender mirrors. I am more conversant with historic rego.

Does anyone know what ADR refers to fender mirrors?

seeyuzz
river

River, ADR 14 (2nd Edition) is the relevant requirement for passenger cars, like your RA2#'s.

It's not a 'fender mirror' ADR, as such, but it does have prescribed requirements governing field of view. This is where I believe the issue exists for fender mirrors. (Also need to be able to adjust from driver's seat.)

**TheStitt** · 08-10-2010, 12:40 PM

Greg

We are pre fender mirror ADR. Unless its changed in the 3 years since my car has been engineered but make car is legal with the Fender mirrors because of the age.

As for seat belts. Before my car was 7MGTE and just a 4M I got pulled over with 7 people in the car and only 4 belts. With a fully rego'd car. Got left off. Took a bit of talking but the car never had them fitted so they weren't required. You just have to have the belted seats filled first. So when lapping with the wagon we always ran 4 in the corners where the belts where and then the 5 -6-7 passengers could the start sitting in the dickie seat.

Now my car has a later model engine in it. I had to fit ADR belts to all seating locations for it to be legal.

**river** · 08-10-2010, 01:06 PM

Hi,

Originally Posted by Supra1978

River, ADR 14 (2nd Edition) is the relevant requirement for passenger cars, like your RA2#'s.

It's not a 'fender mirror' ADR, as such, but it does have prescribed requirements governing field of view. This is where I believe the issue exists for fender mirrors. (Also need to be able to adjust from driver's seat.)

Thanks for that. I went and checked out those ADRs and there is no specific instance or rule that says you cannot have fender mirrors. It does state though, that any external mirror must be flexible so it breaks off (without sharp bits exposed) when some spasso pedastrian hits your car. Also must be within a certain degree of angle from the drivers "occular points" (why don't they just say eyes?) which the fender mirrors are - and much better (ie less angle) to turn to see the fender mirror than door mirrors. Also external mirrors, if visible through the windscreen (which almost implies fender mirrors), must be visible through a portion that is swept by the wiper blades. External mirrors, other than for providing the specified rear field of vision, must not protude beyond the body work of the vehicle. Driver mirror must be adjustable by the driver when seated - either remotely or by hands through the open window.

My fender mirrors on The 88 (1973) cover all of the above, except the internal adjustment for the driver side mirror. The fender mirrors for Trini (1977) cover all above aspects.

So it comes down to the actual rear field of view the fender mirrors provide. All the maths and stuff is in the ADR. I copied it and, for interests sake, find somewhere nice flat and quiet and measure the rear field of vision. Technically, if the fender mirrors equal or excel the ADR requirements, then they are legal to have. So, I could put them onto a non-historic plated vehicle, such as Trini, and be perfectly legal.

seeyuzz
river

**SilverRA23** · 08-10-2010, 04:09 PM

Buggers me what all the fuss is about... you could import a 1970's Left Hand drive yank tank and put it on CH plates here in Victoria... it doesn't meet ADR's of the time simply by being LHD, but its perfectly acceptable to be on CH plates here.

I'd be very surprised if you got sued by any one over it either.. since I would imagine you would be quite specific with insurance companies over what it is etc. The same with most CH plated cars and insurance.. any owner who has gone to the trouble of putting their car on CH plates is going to be quite explicit as to what their car is with their insurers to make sure they aren't in the shit if something sad happens.

The reality of CH/H plates here in Victoria is that the police have just about no idea what is allowable on the cars and given they are generally driven on club events and driven sensibly there is very little drama associated with it. Indeed as far as we can tell, the police can't even look up the details of a CH plated car on their computer systems.

Its one thing to go by the letter of the ADR rule book... then there is the reality of what happens in the real world... if you are being sensible and driving a CH plated car to/from a club event in Victoria, you are not likely to get in the sh*t.

Hell there are race cars and all sorts of things on club plates. No one blinks an eyelid.

**RONA** · 08-10-2010, 04:15 PM

Don't even need CH/H plates in NSW, anything over 30 years old can be registered in LHD, just needs to meet all relevant ADRs for the period and pass a roadworthy.