Drag tyres/rims for FWD cars! !

[_ShadowZ]

Ok i'll tell you my car, then let the suggestions flow in.
91 SV21 toyota camry 3SGTE 200hp (ATM, aiming for about 400hp at end of year after rebuild), Koni shocks, king springs, 5 x 100 stud pattern, etc,etc.

Wanting to get a set of rims and tyres for dedicated drag racing. As in they will be only put on the car at the drag strip (so include slicks if you think they are better suited). Obviously its needs as much traction as possible, so side wall and width are needed to be good.

My current mode of thinking was to use my stock 14's (x 4.5inch) get them re-made to be 14 x 8 inches. put some 225/60 Slicks on them, and hope like hell it works.

well I know jack about drag tyres and what not, so i'll let you guys suggest the best way to do this.

Thanks in advance for all info...

_ShadowZ

p.s. Please include brands if possible.

[-==L=a=N=c=E==-]

Instead of widening the stock rim, find a wider rim that comes stock.

The ST185 rim is 15x6.5" you can get some fat slicks on those with ease.

You have to consider a few things though. For example, how big a slick to get, as it'll affect your gearing as well.

Personally, i'd start at your suspension and work your way down to the tires. The slicks will help you grip, but will be worthless if your suspension is not upto scratch.

Use runners on the rear of the car, stiffen the rear of the car up as much as possible. And move as much weight forward of the front axle as possible. This will insure you have plenty of weight which will aid traction. You want to avoid weightshift, totally oopposite to what you want in a RWD car.

[draza]

here are some ideas. I currently use Toyo's 205/60r14, they're more of a wet weather tyre, but i can smoke em all i want so i do. I would say that getting a 15' rim and using 225's with a full slick or semi-slick for just the drags. If u get a semi slick u should be able to use it at the track too.

http://www.mdmotorsport.com.au/catal...oosier&catid=1

http://www.mickeythompsontires.com/strip.html

http://www.buy-asap.com/category294_1.htm

[_ShadowZ]

Lance, as I said in my intro I have koni shocks (adjustables)
What are runner on the rear??
How the hell do I move weight forward of front axle?? I think i'm the heaviest single item rear of the front axle. I don't get what you mean exactly.
with regards to using 15x6.5, I wanted a fatter rim to get fatter tyres on but according to the mickythompson website (thanks draza) I could fit them on smaller width as well. Yay saving money on custom rims, maybe...
I was also looking at the custom rims for the offset so I don't scrap rubber on the inner part of the gaurd, as my 215/45r17 scrap when close to full lock.. but I guess you don't turn much during a drag race! LOL.

Thought about gearing, at the moment i'm crossing the line at redline of fourth, I have been told this is perfect, so keep overall tyre size the same...

draza, with the semi slicks would they be just as good for drags, or if i'm only going to do drags stick to the full slicks???

[-==L=a=N=c=E==-]

Koni shocks you may have, but i mean tighten the whole rear end up. That is the hardest shocks you can find, and the hardest springs you can fit. Or go to a sold strut setup.

As for 'runners' front runners used on drag cars, bascially a thin tire.

Moving weight forward, if you want to get serious, bascially remove everything from behind the drivers seats. The heaviest item in the rear has got to be the tank.

But by the sounds of it, you want it still as a daily driver?


With the gearing, with more power, you'll be crossing the line in 5th. Also what gearbox are you running? You may need an LSD in the front.

[draza]

personally i'd get the semi slicks as i'll probally go to a track day in the future. I've seen lots of ppl drag in semi's. Get the slicks when u can't get the tracking down and have an LSD and don't want to get larger tyres. It really comes down to $$$. I'm low so i use what i got. I look for things that i can use at many different events.

As for the custom rims, I wouldn't bother unless u r looking for a 10 sec quarter.

[_ShadowZ]

So for runners I could just use my stocks???
Daily driver = yes
I'm using the st185 gt-4 gearbox(customed to FWD), already got the stock LSD.

So larger tyres (circumfrance) with more HP will get me accross the line in a lower gear??

10 sec 1/4, would be nice but looks a little impossible, especially with FWD. LOL

[myne]

High powered FWD's benefit from wheelie bars.
There are a few 8sec FWD's in the USA

[draza]

granted they are highly modified tube frame.

Runners yes you could use your stockies. If you could find rims that are lighter would be better. You have to remember that while you increase the circumfrance you increase the topspeed of the gear and also the KW that the car is putting out. BUT you decrease the tourque. You don't want to increase the circumfrance by too much. You can have large kw figures but with out the torque to go with it there is no point.

That gear box is strong enuff, but it is also heavy. For drag racing you want to get the lightest car with the best downforce over the power wheels. That box is about 20kgs more that what i use. When going down the quarter remember to remove all the seats and lighter wheels. With my combination of seats out and different rims i've managed to get rid of about 50kgs.

[Bahnugget]

considered using subraru (wrx, liberty) rims? i'm sure you could find a wider rim that would fit, as far as i know, the differnt offset causes scrubbing when you turn, but hopefully you wont be turning a greeat deal on the strip

[chris davey]

Not sure how this applies for fwd, but in a rwd if you fit a bias ply slick (MT etc.) you have to run a bias ply front runner. These are about $200 each and you need mega skinny wheels as well. This would be the opposite in your car as they would be rear runners.

Firstly, I would be plonking your weight, expected hp into some ET and MPH calcs and seeing what comes out. Remember that these are for a perfect traction RWD run but a good estimate. You want to know what you will be trapping e.g. 115mph

Then find out what the ratios of your gearbox are and plonk the data into a rpm/speed calculator with your stock tyres. Check that it is correct to what you currently have.

Then change the tyre size until the speed you cross the line at is around the point that your car will make max hp. This is a controversial point as some people say max power and others say max torque.

Then once you work out what size you need, check out some brands and see how much they are etc. and what will fit on your rims.

I would recommend a drag radial as you can then run regular rear tyres which is a lot cheaper. Also, if you plan on running in a class check the rules in sport fwd and front runner and see what times people are running and if you will be competitive.

Good Luck

Chris

[_ShadowZ]

Bahnugget, I already running wrx rims (Speedy, Atix 5 hyper chrome). yes they rub due to offset, but only close to full lock. which in a camry is pretty shit anyway. damn turning circles.

myne, wheely bar that's to force the weight onto the front wheels more, right?? wouldn't that be easier than changing springs etc, etc. just get to the drags and bolt everything on.... Would the drag pit inspection go ape if I have non engineered wheely bar??? as in get my mechanic to "knock one up".

Draza, the gearbox weight, wouldn't that be good as it keeps the weight forward/on the drive axle??

Chris, thanks for that info.

My best time down the strip so far is 14.369sec @ 101.12 mph, 60' of 2.463 (theres my traction issue). Other times are just slower than that. worst was a 14.7.

_ShadowZ

[draza]

You want down force over the front wheels. Easyest way is extra weight, but this then has to be offset by extra power.

Wheely bars wouldn't work so well in the traditional sence. As soon as the front wheels leave the ground the lose of power would drop them back down. Hardest suspension in the rear is what you want, it'll give the best transfer of weight to the front.

I've got the toymods record for the ST162 3sgte. That was using 5psi, full interior and street tyres(toyo proxes H4s).

[myne]

myne, wheely bar that's to force the weight onto the front wheels more, right?? wouldn't that be easier than changing springs etc, etc. just get to the drags and bolt everything on.... Would the drag pit inspection go ape if I have non engineered wheely bar??? as in get my mechanic to "knock one up".

Something along those lines. I imagine that they have *some* clearance between the ground under normal conditions, but firmly prevent the front lifting under hard accelleration in the 1st couple of gears.

Go look at some American FWD drag racing sites - I'm sure there's info on wheelie bars out there.

Drazza; FWD wheelie bars, by my understanding, have maybe an inch of clearance, whereas RWD wheelie bars have a lot more clearance. They're not there to prevent the car flipping on its' ass, they're there to do the same job as stiff springs, but with a much further fulcrum.

[oldcorollas]

actually, wheelie bars are there to prevent diff rotation, and to increase downward pressure on the diff/tyres... proper wheelie bars aren't connected to the car... just the diff...
have a look at vids of drag cars taking off.... power on, wheelie bars down, car goes forward

so how do FWD wheelie bars work? are they just a chassis extension? or are they connected to front suspension somehow to force the wheels down harder? (edit.. oh right.. just chassis extension...)