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Thread: 3VZ-FE into st184 5th gen celica.... now running....yippeee

  1. #31
    Zub Zub Domestic Engineer Gavatron's Avatar
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    Default Re: engine swap......3VZ-FE into st184 5th gen celica

    I'd do all the front seals and timing belt on any motor, just for the fact that it takes half an hour to do it out of the car, rather than hours.

    And that's on any motor, let alone a Camry V6 that are know to leak out of cam/crank seals and have timing belts that are hard enough to do in a Camry sized engine bay, let alone a smaller Celica bay.
    || 91 MX83 Cressida Grande 1JZGTE - Daily || 84 MA61 Supra 2JZGE - Track ||

  2. #32
    Founding ****** Automotive Encyclopaedia Mos's Avatar
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    Default Re: engine swap......3VZ-FE into st184 5th gen celica

    Quote Originally Posted by Gavatron
    I'd do all the front seals and timing belt on any motor, just for the fact that it takes half an hour to do it out of the car, rather than hours.
    I would too, but I also know that I haven't always

    Quote Originally Posted by Gavatron
    And that's on any motor, let alone a Camry V6 that are know to leak out of cam/crank seals and have timing belts that are hard enough to do in a Camry sized engine bay, let alone a smaller Celica bay.
    You work for toyota? Do you find that seals leak because the seals are bad or because the crankcase breathers are all blocked up? I have found that engines with blocked breathers will blow out new, correctly installed seals not solving the problem, but resulting in more work and cost.
    I've also had engines with well over 140kkms on them that I would not touch the seals if they were not leaking.

    Would you replace timing belt idlers and tensioners? spark plugs? leads? dissy cap? clutch? get flywheel machined? replace flywheel bolts? get injectors cleaned? replace all hoses?
    Where do you draw the line?

    Woud you (specifically) do everything that you're suggesting, if you bought a camry?

    On the 1UZ I replaced the front and rear main seal, but I didn't touch the cam seals because they are $60 each (genuine only) and you have to pull the VVTi actuator partially apart and take the cams out to the change them (not sign of leaking and clear crankcase breathers). I had a toyota engine manual but I still decided against doing it.

    I did not replace the waterpump - this was a calculated risk as pretty much every 1UZ I've known to have been involved in a conversion did not ever need the pump changed, even well after 100kkms. It's also something that usually leaks first so you are not that likely to get stranded by a pump that's starting to fail.

    I also did not get the injectors cleaned, nor did I replace sparks plugs (they will be getting cleaned and replaced over the next month, but they didn't get done two years ago).

    I did however, replace the timing belt idler and tensioner even though the originals probably would have been fine. Ed probably spent somewhere between $10k and $20k on his engine and made the call that his original ones were fine.

    You have to draw the line somewhere otherwise the costs escalate for (sometimes) no benefit, and can actually cause problems if you don't replace them properly.

    The body mods are not my thing either, but I'd like to see this conversion happen, whether or not the engine is in tip top shape. Provide the advice, but don't harp on it (please ).

    Mos.
    Admin, I.T., Founding Member, Toymods Car Club Inc.
    2000 IS200 Sports Luxury 1UZ-FE VVTi, 1991 MX83 Grande 2JZ-GTE (sold)

  3. #33
    Zub Zub Domestic Engineer Gavatron's Avatar
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    Default Re: engine swap......3VZ-FE into st184 5th gen celica

    Quote Originally Posted by Mos
    You work for toyota?
    Yup.
    Do you find that seals leak because the seals are bad or because the crankcase breathers are all blocked up? I have found that engines with blocked breathers will blow out new, correctly installed seals not solving the problem, but resulting in more work and cost.
    I've also had engines with well over 140kkms on them that I would not touch the seals if they were not leaking.
    It's not crankcase pressure, it's just that these motors are getting to the age where the seals are leaking. Look on just about any SDV10 or VDV10 Camry with over 120k-150k km and at least one seal behind the timing cover will be leaking.

    Would you replace timing belt idlers and tensioners? spark plugs? leads? dissy cap? clutch? get flywheel machined? replace flywheel bolts? get injectors cleaned? replace all hoses?
    Where do you draw the line?

    Woud you (specifically) do everything that you're suggesting, if you bought a camry?
    If it was in car you'd do it as it fails.

    With the motor in the car you've got a good opportunity to make life easier for yourself. I would at the very least get a non-genuine timing kit that comes with idlers, belt and all front seals. Doesn't cost much.

    Most of the other things you have listed are not hard to do in the car, bar the clutch/flywheel. He will be able to inspect the clutch/flywheel when installing it and determine if it will be serviceable.

    I also understand where you're coming from. You could whack the motor in and have no problems for the whole time you own the car. Or, you could whack it in and have it leaking oil in under 5000km. I'm just a fan of preventative maintenance, especially when it's going to save me many hours if I have to do it later.
    || 91 MX83 Cressida Grande 1JZGTE - Daily || 84 MA61 Supra 2JZGE - Track ||

  4. #34
    Long Time Reader Backyard Mechanic willwal98's Avatar
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    Default Re: engine swap......3VZ-FE into st184 5th gen celica

    hey, great project. Im a huge fan of the 3vz. One thing I am interested in knowing is the wiring. Are you going after market and if so what are you doing about the vvti? And if you are keeping the original ECU are there any tricks to migrating it to a different car?
    Hello.

  5. #35
    Zub Zub Domestic Engineer Gavatron's Avatar
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    Default Re: engine swap......3VZ-FE into st184 5th gen celica

    No *VZ has VVTi...
    || 91 MX83 Cressida Grande 1JZGTE - Daily || 84 MA61 Supra 2JZGE - Track ||

  6. #36
    Long Time Reader Backyard Mechanic willwal98's Avatar
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    Default Re: engine swap......3VZ-FE into st184 5th gen celica

    oh sorry, was thinking of the mz series. My mistake.
    Hello.

  7. #37
    always looking like a Grease Monkey fibrewizard's Avatar
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    Default Re: engine swap......3VZ-FE into st184 5th gen celica

    Quote Originally Posted by willwal98
    hey, great project. Im a huge fan of the 3vz. One thing I am interested in knowing is the wiring. Are you going after market and if so what are you doing about the vvti? And if you are keeping the original ECU are there any tricks to migrating it to a different car?

    3vz series motors don't have vvti, your possibly thinking of the 1mz.............

    yet to decide on an ecu......... it would be alot less hassle to wire in an aftermarket one for fuel and spark timing, but is this a need or a want.............later on when i turbo i will need one,,,, but for current situation stock ecu will be more then good enough...... just a pain in the ass to wire up and in my budget i have allowed for it to be professionally wired if things get to confusing for me...... but i have mates and other re-sources that i can call on aswell...

    no tricks, just need wiring diagrams for both motor and celica so that it is all writen in front of me and easily followed, the trick is knowing and understanding the diagrams....

    still got a couple of weeks to go before i start with the conversion so i will be doing more research untill then........ i have spoken to a couple of ecu places and feedback is good also research on other cars in the states that have done this conversion..........one lad in particular has got toyota supra twin turbo set-up....... running stock ecu, and internals, pushing 14 PSI and making like 400+ hp...... all on stock equipment......... so do i really need an aftermarket ecu and other bits...........
    86GT manual, Velocity Orange, (awaiting build and delivery)
    V6 powered 5th gen celica.(daily).
    91 st185 aus delivered, V6 turb project, possible 3sgte build??????????
    st204 auto, (wifes daily)

  8. #38
    always looking like a Grease Monkey fibrewizard's Avatar
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    Default Re: engine swap......3VZ-FE into st184 5th gen celica

    new steering wheel and V6 preperation......

    paint i had laying around and wheel was $40






    still yet to decide about ecu........use stock or go aftermarket...... my delema......
    been informed by a stall owner at summernats that my cv's will fit the E153 camry box so this looks like the way it will be going........
    86GT manual, Velocity Orange, (awaiting build and delivery)
    V6 powered 5th gen celica.(daily).
    91 st185 aus delivered, V6 turb project, possible 3sgte build??????????
    st204 auto, (wifes daily)

  9. #39
    always looking like a Grease Monkey fibrewizard's Avatar
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    Default Re: engine swap......3VZ-FE into st184 5th gen celica

    now with sc14 supercharger to go on.....once engine condition is determined....



    pics to come....


    conversion date set for next weekend.....
    86GT manual, Velocity Orange, (awaiting build and delivery)
    V6 powered 5th gen celica.(daily).
    91 st185 aus delivered, V6 turb project, possible 3sgte build??????????
    st204 auto, (wifes daily)

  10. #40
    always looking like a Grease Monkey fibrewizard's Avatar
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    Default Re: engine swap......3VZ-FE into st184 5th gen celica




    86GT manual, Velocity Orange, (awaiting build and delivery)
    V6 powered 5th gen celica.(daily).
    91 st185 aus delivered, V6 turb project, possible 3sgte build??????????
    st204 auto, (wifes daily)

  11. #41
    always looking like a Grease Monkey fibrewizard's Avatar
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    Default Re: engine swap......3VZ-FE into st184 5th gen celica

    ok conversion update...

    day 1........
    started at 4pm
    ripped 5sfe out, took all air conditioning related hoses and condensers out.....


    day 2...

    dereased and cleaned entire engine bay.........
    prepped v6... with mounts off 5sfe..... however due to information gathered...... only 1 of the 3 mounts would transfer without any modification......and cv's are not the same diameter as i had also been told that they were....... so dicied to bite the bullet and use my 184 gearbox.....which bolted straight onto 3vzfe without any dramas......

    for clutch i am using my 184 exedy heavy duty clutch plate....and the camry pressure plate and camry flywheel..........
    this way i can still use 184 drive shafts as long as they can handle the power.....lol....will see how long for

    day 3...........

    custom made adapter plate for cv carrier (centre) bearing.....as this could not be directly bolted to 3vzfe block as mounting holes where way out...........

    also finished that brackets and mounts for the sc14 supercharger..... used the belt off the 5sfe for charger and also used and destroyed and re-fabricated 5sfe support brace for the intake..to mount the sc14 charger.....

    the v6 is now completely prepped and ready to go into its new home in my celica's engine bay........
    tomorrows job..........lol
    86GT manual, Velocity Orange, (awaiting build and delivery)
    V6 powered 5th gen celica.(daily).
    91 st185 aus delivered, V6 turb project, possible 3sgte build??????????
    st204 auto, (wifes daily)

  12. #42
    always looking like a Grease Monkey fibrewizard's Avatar
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    Default Re: engine swap......3VZ-FE into st184 5th gen celica

    so relieved only got a few more things to do.........

    gearbox dust cover plate....
    powersteering lines
    supercharger and intercooler piping....
    modify celica timing cover side engine mount to v6 block mounting point.......
    fill engine, gearbox, and supercharger with new fluids.....
    intercooler mounts...
    wirein v6 ecu.....(though i might get an auto elec to do that.....
    better brake rotors
    new cv's
    springs
    then fire it up......
    86GT manual, Velocity Orange, (awaiting build and delivery)
    V6 powered 5th gen celica.(daily).
    91 st185 aus delivered, V6 turb project, possible 3sgte build??????????
    st204 auto, (wifes daily)

  13. #43
    Needs a backyard to be a Backyard Mechanic Jaemus's Avatar
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    Default Re: engine swap......3VZ-FE into st184 5th gen celica

    outstanding mate
    very interested to see how well the SC14 actually works on the 3VZ
    i suspect you may have to change the pulley
    1997 JZX100 Chaser Tourer V - 1JZ-GTE VVTi
    Built Australia's first V6 MR2 >> Winner: "I'd Drive It" award - Toyfest '07 ** MR2 V6 conversion info and advice PM me! **

  14. #44
    Estranged Member Chief Engine Builder mullett's Avatar
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    Default Re: engine swap......3VZ-FE into st184 5th gen celica

    Nice work...Good to see the V6 fraternity growing stronger

    -RM.

  15. #45
    always looking like a Grease Monkey fibrewizard's Avatar
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    Default Re: engine swap......3VZ-FE into st184 5th gen celica

    got a few issues with the supercharger.... that are easily solved but just a pain.......

    1st....stock SC14 clutched pulley contacts chassis rail.....so non-clutched pulley is the answer......

    also due to not being able to make mounting whilst motor was in the celica we got bottom radiotor mount that charger aslo contacts..... this will be solved by moving radiator mounts and leaning radiator forward at the bottom about 5mm but going an inch to be sure........

    also does anyone know the stock harmonic balancer size in mm for the 1ggze.... just so i can work out boost.....
    86GT manual, Velocity Orange, (awaiting build and delivery)
    V6 powered 5th gen celica.(daily).
    91 st185 aus delivered, V6 turb project, possible 3sgte build??????????
    st204 auto, (wifes daily)

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