MA61 - RA65 Struts & Powersteering Arms conversion

[wilbo666]

Here are some overlays that I did many moons ago

One thing to note is that you need to ream the RA65 ball joint hole to fit xZ1x or MA61.

MZ10 Power Steering (No non-PS option) [Longer] vs RA65 Power Steering [Shorter]

Overlay based on strut holes:


Overlay based on balljoint hole:


Side overlay:


Cheers
Wilbo

[wilbo666]

toyodiy shows MA61/RA65/RT142/MZ11
as the same part

which in reality. its not. at all.

The real EPC doesn't show that



Cheers
Wilbo

[Admiral coFF33]

wilbo, what about RT142 vs RA65 in the "Real" EPC?

[wilbo666]

wilbo, what about RT142 vs RA65 in the "Real" EPC?

Same.



Cheers
Wilbo

[patrickleslie]

Holy thread revival Batman!

Does anyone know what the sizes are (internal diameter) for the Supra knuckle ball joint hole and the size for the Celica knuckle ball joint hole? How much do you need to ream out of the Celica hole to make it fit the Supra ball joint?

Thanks

[wilbo666]

Info is all on my wiki Patrick.

wilbo666 / RA6x vs MZ1x-MA6x

Cheers
Wilbo

[patrickleslie]

That is more info that I could have imagined, thanks Wilbo!

[ma61anthony]

Thanks after reading that link reduced track? Is that a bad thing? Sorry dont really understand too much of this I read through this thread before and seen doing this gives negative camber but in the link says positive camber? Just a bit confused lol I know of big gains in steering by doing this as ma61 steering sucks but is there a good gain in the struts? What I understand if u change steering arms need to change with matching struts? Thanks

[marvis]

Steering arm spacing is the same, just RA65 has more lock and a better feel.

The track decrease is only small, nothing to worry about.

I have run ra6x struts in both ma61 and mz10. Gives around -2 camber.

[patrickleslie]

Anthony All those glorious specs that Wilbo has provided are if you use the Celica arms only, not the struts too. If you use the struts then its totally different. The axel stub angle of the Celica struts vs the Supra struts means -2 camber, like Marvis said.

[rokusan]

hi guys because this thread is about my question i put it here-soz

my sa63 wants toyota front end back, what do i need? coilovers maybe ae86?
what lca? for max track etc
what steering arms to fit? short and straight
hubs and brakes? currently s13/r32 would like to keep the 4spots if pos.

I know its asking too much for a formula, but i'm desparate and you guys are encyclopeadias...

[patrickleslie]

If you use AE86 coilovers then you will need to use AE86 arms. The strut bolt spacing is different at the bottom and wont suit any xA6x knuckles. That being said, there are PLENTY of aftermarket AE86 arms that you could use too.

Off the top of my head...you could go SA63 Struts converted to coilovers, sa63 arms, Sigma LCAs / T3 LCAs / something aftermarket, adjusted (longer) tie tod ends, may have to go aftermarket depending on how much your LCAs increase the front track. Not sure about brakes, just google some mods. I'm 90% sure that SA63 and MA61 share the front brakes so you could try searching for MA61 brake mods too.

This is not necessarily a bolt in shopping list.

[ma61anthony]

I have both the celica struts and steering arms because I want more responsive steering does all the ma61 coilover adaptors and shocks still fit the celica stuff. I guess what im thinking ill be needing is my celica struts and steering arms I already have.dont have but looking into shocks, sleeve kit and springs.is there anything ive missed? These adjustable camber tops are they needed to make the top of the shock bolt to car? Looking online at the weld on kits the top hat thing appears to have nothing to bolt it to the 3 holes? So confusing I have been searching but would be nice to get a clear answer thanks.

[patrickleslie]

Yes the shorter celica arms will make for quicker/extra lock steering but will make it heavier on the steering wheel. I think the MA61 and SA63 struts are the same diameter so the coilover sleeves should suit both. Just double check that they are the same yourself with a ruler. From memory the kits need to be an ID of 52mm to suit these struts. AVOID ALUMINIUM SLEEVES. I've heard a few bad stories, steel is better. For shocks, go for KYB AGX shocks (from a Toyota MR2 and a Ford Focus). The 'top hat thing' you speak of is just a spring seat, the camber tops (to go in the 3 holes) are a separate unit. Both are needed.

Ok, so if you're definitely going with Celica struts and arms...that sounds like exactly what I am doing. Or will eventually be doing. Or whatever. Shopping lists below!!

- From the ground up - WITH COILOVER SLEEVE KIT

MA61 LCA - Stock
MA61 Balljoint - Probably a new one, you might as well while it's all apart.
SA63 Steering Arm - Drill the balljoint hole to suit, as per specs in Wilbo's wiki or take an MA61 balljoint with you to a machine workshop and ask them to make it fit in your SA63 arms.
Tie Rod Ends - must be adjusted longer to suit the shorter arms. AFAIK you can use SA63 or MA61 parts.
SA63 Strut - No modification needed to the base, will bolt into the SA63 arms even after modifying the arms to suit the Supra balljoint.
Coilover Sleeve - You will probably want to cut 20(??)mm off the strut to fit the coil sleeves. This is well documented, I can't remember exactly the details right now. You have to cut something out of the middle to make it suit the...
KYB AGX Shock!! Which are the MR2 Rear springs. Again, this is well documented, part numbers are in some thread somewhere I'm sure. Cant remember off the top of my head.
Coilover spring seat and locking nut - as per kit
Spring - to suit whatever rear spring you have!! I wouldn't recommend going something hardcore like 10kg fronts if you only have King Low springs in the rear. or whatever. BALANCE is probably key
Spring hat - flat hats are relatively 'teh suck' for easy adjustment, get a raised hat instead.
Camber tops - Cusco make some to suit MZ10, I THINK it fits MA61. T3 make some that I KNOW fit. xA6x Celica units will fit but will be 60 degrees rotated from the xA6x Supra ones!! Therefore if you use a Celica top you can get mega castor and ok camber adjustment but obviously both at the same time. This may or may not be what you are looking for.

Coilovers here means you can adjust it to whatever you want. Don't go too stiff, don't go too soft either. IMO if you don't balance it with the rear then you're gonna have a bad time.

OR

- From the ground up - WITH STOCK CELICA STRUTS

MA61 LCA - as above
MA61 Balljoint - as above
SA63 Steering Arm - as above
Tie Rod Ends - as above
SA63 Strut - as above
KYB Excel G Shock - suits stock length, no need for spacers, goes alright with king springs, a reasonable option for a daily. (You could fit the KYB AGX here but you will need a spacer, I would recommend a bottom spacer to get maximum stroke out of it)
SA63 Spring - the easy way out is to go king springs all round. KTFL-26 (listed for Celica, to suit your Celica struts. I have no idea if the Supra listed springs will fit in the celica strut...) at the front and FTRL-27 ( listed for Supra - THERE IS ALSO A PART LISTED FOR 'IRS CELICA' BUT THEY ARE TALLER AND SOFTER. Your call mate) at the rear. This is what I intend to run in the meantime while I wait for some funds to get proper coilover set up at the front and some custom wound springs at the back. Better double check those part numbers too, they're off the top of my head.
SA63 Spring Hat - Stock, to suit the springs.
Stock supra strut tops - No point fitting camber tops at this point if you can't get any adjustment due to the stupidly large sized spring right?

This will cause you to scrape the front bumper on the ground if you really push the car over a good dip or uneven hills road or drive WAY too quickly over a spoon drain or something. There is one particular corner that does this on Mount Lofty Summit Road that I have in mind . I do not know how high or low this will sit in a Supra as I haven't done it yet, gimme two weeks lol. I do know that the same springs and shocks in my SA63 was ~120mm from the crossmember at the front and ~110mm from the exhaust at the back (yeah yeah i know, I should've measured from the rails meh too late now)

PM me if you have specific questions

[rokusan]

thanks guys, i have realized my s13 front end doesn't work in a toyota as the sa63 has a low relative crossmember to a nissan... roll center fail