Classic celica suspension TA23

[andurils_sheath]

[QUOTE=BigWorm]If you're looking at koni shocks, rav4 reds fit the rear & are 15mm shorter stroke, & rav4 yellows fit the front & give you external adjustment. But bilsteins would be favourable....QUOTE]


Would this work for TA22?? I fairly sure rears would be similar but fronts not sure.

Im really finding it hard finding good dampers for the front of a ta22.

[TwentyTwo]

R/TA23 struts are different size to the TA22 units, so I'd suggest thats a negative Houston...

Munroe list the same rear shock part numbers for TA22 and RA23/28...

[poorolla]

I have just recently got an RA23 myself and i am currently doing the same thing and trying to improve its handling...
So far i have got whiteline front and rear swaybars, lowered king springs and kyb shocks to go in it, along with some fresh nolathane bushes. I think this should yeild a pretty good improvement over standard, i will let you know once i get it all in..
I am also fitting some 15 inch wheels with 195/50 rubber which should help a bit too but i think my speedo will end up being out a little bit ??
I also want to try and get between 1.5 - 2.5 degrees camber on the front but i'm not sure how i'll go about this yet. Does anyone know of any longer lower-control-arms from other cars that will fit the RA23? How do people generally get some camber on these cars?
The biggest improvent in handling i made on my last car was some front camber, it would just love to turn in Definantly something to think about if you are experiencing understeer..

[wraith]

I am also fitting some 15 inch wheels with 195/50 rubber which should help a bit too but i think my speedo will end up being out a little bit ??

What's the stock wheel / tyre combo?

I also want to try and get between 1.5 - 2.5 degrees camber on the front but i'm not sure how i'll go about this yet. Does anyone know of any longer lower-control-arms from other cars that will fit the RA23?

Longer arms were a great trick on TA22 Celicas. As well as gaining neg camber, you also reduced Ackerman angles (induced tyre scrub on turn for safety reasons) which improves cornering speeds. Can be a spooky on the road until you get used to it...

The post can be found at http://forums.toymods.org.au/index.p...t=0#msg_526721 on the old forums. Maybe email him?

Ash

[stradlater]

usually the rubber in the trailing arms are in okay condition anyhow.

No No... Soooooo not true....

[poorolla]

good thread wraith, thanks Next time i'm down at the wrecker i'll be checking out these sigma control arms for sure..
As for the stock tyre/wheel combo its 185/75 R14..
i think a 185/60 R14 would be closer to the 195/50 R15's i'm fitting so it looks like i'll have a smaller rolling diameter than stock..
Are there any speedo drives from other models that might be able to compensate for this?

[o_man_ra23]

Get the correct sized tyres and you wont have a problem, or change to a longer ratio diff, otherwise you will be revving at 4000rpm at 100kph with that sort of tyre.

Cheers, Owen

[wraith]

Guessing at your diff ratio and gearbox here, but this is what the Quaife speed calc gave me:
Gearbox:- W55
Tyre:- 185/75/R14
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Top Gear gives 34.243 KPH/1000 RPM and a top speed of 205.457 KPH at 6000 RPM

Engine speeds in top gear:-
40 KPH = 1168 RPM 50 KPH = 1460 KPM 60 KPH = 1752 RPM 80 KPH = 2336 RPM
100 KPH = 2920 RPM 110 KPH = 3212 RPM 130 KPH = 3796 RPM 160 KPH = 4673 RPM

Top Speed in 1 gear = 48.918 KPH
And changes into 2 gear at 3462 RPM dropping 2538 RPM
Top Speed in 2 gear = 84.776 KPH
And changes into 3 gear at 4019 RPM dropping 1981 RPM
Top Speed in 3 gear = 126.550 KPH
And changes into 4 gear at 4348 RPM dropping 1652 RPM
Top Speed in 4 gear = 174.639 KPH
And changes into 5 gear at 5100 RPM dropping 900 RPM
Top Speed in 5 gear = 205.457 KPH
************************************************** ****************************************
Gearbox:- W55
Tyre:- 195/50/R15
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Top Gear gives 31.155 KPH/1000 RPM and a top speed of 186.927 KPH at 6000 RPM

Engine speeds in top gear:-
40 KPH = 1284 RPM 50 KPH = 1605 KPM 60 KPH = 1926 RPM 80 KPH = 2568 RPM
100 KPH = 3210 RPM 110 KPH = 3531 RPM 130 KPH = 4173 RPM 160 KPH = 5136 RPM

Top Speed in 1 gear = 44.506 KPH
And changes into 2 gear at 3462 RPM dropping 2538 RPM
Top Speed in 2 gear = 77.130 KPH
And changes into 3 gear at 4019 RPM dropping 1981 RPM
Top Speed in 3 gear = 115.136 KPH
And changes into 4 gear at 4348 RPM dropping 1652 RPM
Top Speed in 4 gear = 158.888 KPH
And changes into 5 gear at 5100 RPM dropping 900 RPM
Top Speed in 5 gear = 186.927 KPH
************************************************** ****************************************

You'd be heaps better off with a 195/65/R15 or a 205/60/R15:

Gearbox:- W55
Tyre:- 205/60/R15
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Top Gear gives 33.913 KPH/1000 RPM and a top speed of 203.478 KPH at 6000 RPM

Engine speeds in top gear:-
40 KPH = 1179 RPM 50 KPH = 1474 KPM 60 KPH = 1769 RPM 80 KPH = 2359 RPM
100 KPH = 2949 RPM 110 KPH = 3244 RPM 130 KPH = 3833 RPM 160 KPH = 4718 RPM

Top Speed in 1 gear = 48.447 KPH
And changes into 2 gear at 3462 RPM dropping 2538 RPM
Top Speed in 2 gear = 83.959 KPH
And changes into 3 gear at 4019 RPM dropping 1981 RPM
Top Speed in 3 gear = 125.331 KPH
And changes into 4 gear at 4348 RPM dropping 1652 RPM
Top Speed in 4 gear = 172.956 KPH
And changes into 5 gear at 5100 RPM dropping 900 RPM
Top Speed in 5 gear = 203.478 KPH
************************************************** ****************************************
Links to tools-
http://www.rochfordtyres.co.uk/tyrecalc.asp
http://www.quaife.co.uk/ (in their downloads section).

cheers

Ash

[WindeX]

If the brakes are locking up, its not from the brakes being good enough. It is from them not working efficiently. Better pads will help this marginally, but bigger discs will seriously help. Either this or your tyres are crap.

SNIP!

Thanks for the awesome informative post, just got a question for you about the above bit in particular.
From my understanding the highest friction point is where there is just a tiny bit of lock(IE this will stop you faster than just skidding), however it is quite close, and even the best street drivers will have a hard time getting their non-locked breaking to match their locked breaking. So if my brekes lock up stopping the wheel completly the breaks overpower the traction of the tyre, thus my breaks are not currently the weak point(its my tyres), once it gets to a stage where my breaks can't overpower the traction of my tyre with the road, thats when they are a weak point.

Of course this doesnt taking into account the better cooling afforded by larger disks and hence better repeated breaking, but I am not talking about fade here, I dont do track work, just the occasional fang around the hills.

Again cheers, for the info, and feel free to rebut me / prove me wrong, I am happy to be corrected.

[o_man_ra23]

Brakes will also lock when the pad binds to the disc from the disc heating too much. The disc will heat up during normal driving with no braking to some extent due to the pads always rubbing the disc. a fang in the hills at higher velocity will heat this up more. Then when going downhill, you will most probably ride the brakes to control gravitational acceleration somewhat, which will cause monsterous heatsoak on the brakes, causing them to be already quite hot before being used. This heat on the brakes bit is a sort of weird affair. They will fade to the point where you have to put shiteloads of pressure on them so they slow you quickly, then lock from the pressure and heat. You will probably be applying the pressure too quickly to notice this part. I think you would find that running slotted rotors of a good brand such as DBA and good pads will help a lot on this. But the braking standards of yesteryear and the braking standards of today are like cheese and chalk. Modern braking systems must be able to pull up a lot better than old ones, and you would find that even when show room new, you brakes would never have passed today's standards for stopping.

Cheers, Owen

[poorolla]

Once again wraith, top effort, thanks for all the info! (+rep earnt)
I picked up the wheels today and they have some old 215/60R15 rubber on them so i'll start with these and see how i go before i decide on a size for the new tyres..
Top links too, very handy!

[23T-GTE]

i have to say RCA's made a massiv difference on my old ra28..
i spent lots of cash and time fiddling with it to getit to handle as well as my mate's rx2.
i did nearly everything listed above and did not have rca's, and when i fitted them it was amazing how much easier the car felt to steer. It may not have improved its actual HANDLING on the road by that much, but the ability to steer it more precisely and smoothly, with more of the right feedback was present.
only other upgrade i didnt do were front strut brace and more negative camber, and less(i think) castor.

i had 24mm front bar, 18mm rear.
KYB all round, kings 1.5"low all round
rebushed the steering box and all steering arms/idlers.
noltec bushes everywhere. fresh ball joints.
15x7 and 15x8rims with goodyr eagle F1s.
this was a good standard, but the steering was stressed and sometimes felt a bit odd at high speeds and thru long sweepers.
then i wacked on the 40mm(?) rca's and the effects on steering response were very noticeable. felt like a new car should.
very happy. best $80 spent ever.

[23T-GTE]

come to think of it, i wonder if the same bloke is still around these forums who makes them himself?
he made a group buy set for AE86's/RA23&8's and they were v.cheap compared to T3 ones...

[poorolla]

I know i would be interested in a set!

[WindeX]

How much in total did the break upgrade cost you? And how hard would it be to get a mechanic to do it for me, I am not totaly sure my skills are up to this kind of upgrade.