MZ20 Soarer starting problem

[whatthe?]

Ahh, the dramas continue. After finally getting the oil delivery issues sorted, it was time to start the bitch up and see what happened. Unfortunately it was very hesitant to start, just a lot of click click click from the starter solenoid (I assume it's the solenoid anyway). Fine says I, I'll chuck in a different fully charged battery. No change. Ok, I'll head off to pickies and grab me another starter. No change. New power lead to the starter? No change.
Ok, so things I now know;

-The starters are fine (unless I have 2 duds, what are the odds?)
-The voltage from battery to starter doesnt drop at all, checked it with my meter, 12.8 volts at both ends.
-The battery is fine, brand new in fact.

I'm stumped quite frankly. It works when it feels like it and cranks in a lively fashion when it decides to get going, the rest of the time is just click click. Anybody got a suggestion? I checked out the MA70 tsrm for the location of the starter relay, it says passenger kick panel, I checked both kick panels, nothing was labeled as such. Anyone know where it is and if this might be the problem? I'm fresh outta ideas

[whatthe?]

Might it be the one next to the circuit opening relay? Part no. is 90987-04002

[Dale]

The symptoms definitely point to that being a strong possibility.
How about the ignition switch at the back of the ignition barrel? That's another common problem - not sure if it effects mz20's though
There was an FAQ posted a few days ago about adding a relay close to the starter to fix problems like this..

Try putting +12v straight to the starter's start wire from the battery and see if it starts then - that will rule out the possibility of two dud starters

[whatthe?]

The symptoms definitely point to that being a strong possibility.
How about the ignition switch at the back of the ignition barrel? That's another common problem - not sure if it effects mz20's though
There was an FAQ posted a few days ago about adding a relay close to the starter to fix problems like this..

Try putting +12v straight to the starter's start wire from the battery and see if it starts then - that will rule out the possibility of two dud starters

thanks for the reply, I actually used the original starter to compression test a 7M out of a car a few weeks back by directly hooking it to a battery and it worked fine. The only reason I bought another one was that an engine which is only compressing 1 cylinder at a time isnt putting the same load on the starter as an engine with 6 plugs in it would and therefore isnt an absolute test. 2 starters doing the same thing exactly however seems a little more conclusive in pointing to another problem.
Since it isnt battery, leads or starter the relay is the last thing I can think of. Failing that I guess I'll have to look into your suggestions of problems elsewhere in the wiring

[sideshow]

it might still be the starter motor

if it clicks pretty easily then the wiring is usually ok

why not remove starter and attach set of jumper leads and bench test it

[Darola]

Hey there mate,

Add a relay to the starter motor, that should fix your problem's

sounds like low voltage from ignition

hope this helps

Eddie

[The Witzl]

Matt,

test the voltage that the solenoid is receiving when you turn the key. This is the small wire that goes to the starter motor, not the massif phat cable

[whatthe?]

Did that earlier, 11.7 volts from the solenoid trigger wire whereas the battery is putting out 12.8 at the posts. What would cause that drop?, Also jumped the trigger on the soleniod direct from the battery, starter turns everytime, so the starter itself would seem to be fine. Changed the relay I spoke of yesterday, dont think it's the right one though, made no differece and the solenoid still clicks even without it in! Does anyone know where the starter relay resides in this thing??

[Admiral coFF33]

im getting this issue with my GZ20 also , so i would love to know what the issue is too ..

Blacksupra said the relay will solve the issue , but how the hell do i install that ?

[Dale]

http://www.toymods.net/forums/showthread.php?t=3334

Doing what's detailed in that guide will very likely solve your problem.

I'd say the part that needs replacing is the ignition switch at the back of the key barrel, the starter wire usually goes from there direct to the starter from my experience.

[BlackSupra]

im getting this issue with my GZ20 also , so i would love to know what the issue is too ..

Blacksupra said the relay will solve the issue , but how the hell do i install that ?

Unfortunetly toyota's wiring is special and doesn't trigger the starter directly off the battery. By having a starter motor relay installed it will bypass the voltage drop of the factory wiring and supply direct power from the battery to the starter, solving the issue of a slightly tired battery.

[whatthe?]

according to the tsrm an ma70 has a starter relay inside the car, does anyone know if the mz20 has one and where it lives?

[whatthe?]

Unfortunetly toyota's wiring is special and doesn't trigger the starter directly off the battery. By having a starter motor relay installed it will bypass the voltage drop of the factory wiring and supply direct power from the battery to the starter, solving the issue of a slightly tired battery.

So what youre suggesting is a relay from the trigger wire on the engine loom that switches to a connection living directly on the battery? Sounds simple enough

[The Witzl]

Fuck it matt - just add one!

[whatthe?]

Done, problem fixed and all it cost me was a 4 pin relay and a pack of spade terminals. In fact, works well enough to highlight a gearbox problem