7mgte fuel and igniton maps? (pics)

[kemicalx]

Hi all,

I was wondering if anyone had some fuel/ign maps i could compare to the ones already uploaded to my EMS DualSport. It is apparently tuned for a 7mgte and the general setup looks pretty right, but i just want to make sure the maps are ok. I only want to use the current maps to get the new motor kicking over, then i'll probally play around a little bit with the settings and once everything is seemingly running smoothly i'll get a propper tune.

Here are some shots of the maps currently installed on my ems, you can see the ems doesn't have great resolution (0-12500rpm with 500rpm incr.) will this be much of a problem?

Fuel map:


Ignition map:


The general ecu setup:

[chris davey]

Why is there only 3 load points? -50,0,50? Would have thought you will need more than that to get a good tune.

Fuel seems to look ok but you need to check it with a wideband before you do anything silly.

Why does the ignition not retard when it is coming on boost? As rpm increases timing needs to advnace but as cylinder pressure increases timing needs to be retarded. The base map for my wolf has about 14 deg advance at full boost (15psi ish) I would definitely retard that timing map before driving it. e.g. top doorslammer I know of runs close to that ignition timing at 53psi of boost and they use the strongest stuff you can and tune it to detonate a bit but the engine is strong enough to handle it. Makes the most power that way but in a regular engine there is VERY little chance of an engine living for a long time.

[kemicalx]

it apparently has 3 load points and 16 curve modifiers, though i don't understand what that means

[kemicalx]

heres what it says in the software manual in regaurd to the curve modifiers

Modifier

The load points in the curve modifier points should only be adjusted after you have tuned the 0 KPA, -50 KPA & +50 KPA Fuel and Ignition points every 500 RPM.
To tune this section every 10 KPA in the vacuum you would choose the RPM range where the engine would be mostly driven or the mid point of the engines RPM range.
For example the 3000 RPM range has been chosen, bring your engine to the corresponding with the kpa load point which your screen has been set to and adjust the fuel change by using the arrow buttons.

To tune in boost the engine may have to be loaded in a high rev. range to obtain boost depending on turbo size and the same procedure used to tune as in vacuum but only using the +50, +100, +150 kpa adjusting points.
(also +200,+250,+300 kpa for high boost version)

The + - or Pg up and Pg down keys adjust the value.
Once you have set the load points to your desired air/fuel ratio / timing , the Ecu will automatically apply these settings to all the RPM ranges.

If this function is not required, set all the KPA load points to 0%.

[chris davey]

in that case, wait for somebody with EMS experience to comment

Matt from Magic Performance is an EMS dealer AFAIK. Maybe try ringing him or another dealer and get them to check it over for you.

[kemicalx]

hmmmm, i hooked up the TPS, and although i can calibrate it by taking a reading at closed, then a reading at WOT it doesn't register any movement on it's gauge screen

edit- oh yes it is. Don't know why it didn't start working straight away lol

[kemicalx]

Why does the ignition not retard when it is coming on boost?

Sorry to dig this back up, but i have another question and theres no point making another thread..

This antilag stuff could be setup to get the ingition to retard correctly yes? Can you recommend how much i should retard and in what situations?


This is what the .pdf says,

Mode 01 selects boost enhancement for rally cars on throttle back off. When the throttle position signal is BELOW the pre-set
TPS level AND when the engines RPM is above the pre-set RPM level, the boost enhancement feature is enabled. When the
boost enhancement is enabled the ECU misfires the Ignition (see Ign. Fire), retards the timing (see Ign Trim) and adds fuel
(see fuel trim). This feature would be used in conjunction with an auxiliary o/p to energise a blow off solenoid valve to either
bypass the throttle body or to blow air directly into the exhaust manifold near the exhaust ports.

[oldcorollas]

for antilag? or just for on boost?

what you need to do is to tune the table of ignition vs load/boost so that it decreases....

that antilag looks on/off... not progressive...

[kemicalx]

Ahhk cheers mate,

So when should it start retarding? As soon as there is positive pressure and then all the way up to maximum boost?

Chris, you said your wolf has 14Deg advance at full boost, what is the change like as rpm increases?

Due to the only having 3 main load points i can map; -50kpa being lightest load, 0kpa then +50kpa being maximum boost I can't fine tune how much it will retard at individual kpa changes. So at maximum boost which will be about 80kpa at 1000rpm (won't happen) could you suggest a suitable timing advance, likewise 80kpa at 6000rpm, then I can fill in the gaps.

I'm not too fussed if the tuning I set up on it isn't optimal, so long as it will allow me to start my new engine and doesn't kill anything. I'll leave the proper tuning to someone else that has a dyno

Thanks a lot guys, Atm I’m trying to get my head around it all. Although the DS lacks tunabilty for my current setup. That also means less stuff for me to mess up, and the software is pretty easy to follow. So it's not bad for learning how fuel/ign works in a car. It also looks to be more useful when running higher levels of boost 200+kpa Having said that, if I can get it to run well enough but want something with better resolution in the future, I might upgrade to a 8860 or an Autronic SMC.

[chris davey]

Maximum boost, do you mean 180kpa? Unless the 0 actually means atmospheric which would be 100kpa. According to http://to4r.com/calcs/enginecalc.php 80 kpa is about -1psi.

From what I can tell, you use the modifiers on the right hand side to retard the timing at different boost levels.


The wolf is only a base map. But basically you would want to run up to say 30* timing or so (from what I have seen) until you start to make boost. So in my car I will start retarding timing at about 3200rpm from the 30*ish to about 14*. It is better to retard it a little too much than not enough on boost. But if you retard it way too much it will still be igniting when the exhaust valve open and your EGT’s will skyrocket. (This is why the antilag has an ignition retard section)

I would set those base figures, -50,0,50 how you have them and do what the manual says to tune for off boost. (if you have a wideband) Otherwise, just drive very sedately to the tuners or if you really want get it towed there.

BTW if you can’t tell I love my wideband o2 and think it is the best thing that I have bought for my car. It helps so much when diagnosing problems

Hope that helps but probably didn’t.

Oh and do a search for timing maps on the old forums as I got some from there but they are on my puter at home. Just find some for a boosted engine and see how they progress.

[pilot]

I noticed you have your fuel trim in -5.xx. You´d like it to be at 0 when doing initial tune up.

[chris davey]

well spotted. And also, if you already have a decent air fuel ratio with the current map and you change that from -5.6 to 0 you will need to up the other number by 5.6% to maintain the same a/f ratio.

[kemicalx]

Thanks for all the help guys +rep all round,

Maximum boost, do you mean 180kpa? Unless the 0 actually means atmospheric which would be 100kpa. According to http://to4r.com/calcs/enginecalc.php 80 kpa is about -1psi.

Chris this is what the manual says in reguard to the three load points:

For
normally aspirated engines there will be two settings per 500 r.p.m. increments, 1st at 0 kpa Full load and 2nd at Light load
(Bring engine to lightest load possible). On forced induction engines ie: Turbo's, there is another setting at full boost.

The converter program i was using says 0kpa = 0psi, and 10kpa=1.45psi so i presumed 80kpa is what i'd need for 11.6psi.

[chris davey]

Difference is the EMS uses 0 for atmospheric and -50 for vacuum and 50 for 7.35psi. The calculator I used has 100 for atmospheric pressure. And 150 would equal 7.35psi (.5bar).

So if you were to run 7.35psi full boost then I don’t think you would need to adjust for any other points above that. Is there modifier points between 0 and 50?

PM sbyder as he is using an ems on a 1jz and may know more of the intricacies.

[chris davey]

Base map for 1jz on powerfc


Untuned map for 1jz on AEM


Hope that helps