upgraded 4age runs just not great.

[oldcorollas]

yes, but you can tell if it is rich or lean from a narrow band.. ...
ie, if it is lean under power, (and the sensor is ok) then you know you haev issues..
if it is rich, you can't tell how rich.. but it is a good yes/no answer to start with, rather just saying "i dunno"

[Sam_Q]

yes I think I see what your getting at

so you cant tell what it is but you will know if its really lean or not

[DeftAnesthetik]

well I have an answer to my problem but i will answer your questions first.

Joshstix: im not sure but the tone of your post seems callous, I AM doing something about this problem myself, in the last 96hrs almost 50 of them have been spent working on this car, i dont expect anyone to be able to directly answer my question as its not a direct one... if your looking to start a war go somewhere else, i only need useful information.

oldcorollas: i will get a pic next time i have the covers off the cams. i did check the o2 (stock single wire) at idle and it was hovering around that 0.5v although it did bounce around a little. i have yet to find the 4 wire i know is here somewhere...... man i have a lot of shit. i just took the connector off a spare resistor block and soldered all three wires together, heatshrink and plugged back in...... im sure thats how i've read it being done before.

well then in a moment of ignorance (or sleep depravity as i have been calling it lately) i managed to wire the injectors wrong (1 & 2 together and 3 & 4 together) switched the plugs on 2 and 3 so it should be fixed, fired it up and it sounds even better, i still have yet to take it out on the road. work starts in 30 minutes though so im gonna find out soon.

if i can find the charger for my camera i will try and take some video and post it up, i have yet to see any footage with a sound like I have..... its giving me chills.

straight up, have a good day and thanks for the help on this one.

[Joshstix]

I'm not trying to start a war and while I wasn't trying to be gentle the aim of my comment was to try and stop you wasting a massive amount of time for a result that isn't worth the effort.

I don't doubt you have spent a heap of time working on the setup but what have you done to change the fueling and timing curves to suit the massive change in engine characteristics that you've made? I just don't understand the refusal to run a tune that is appropriate for the setup.

[DeftAnesthetik]

im backing off running the autronic because its planned for a later date, when the turbo goes on. with dyno time running ever $100 buck an hour i dont want to afford 2 tunings. if the stock ecu will get me through the month or two it takes to finish building the turbo setup (even if its not running the engine to its potential) im going to take it. originally all this stuff and the turbo were going to be put in together but...... i got an itch and had to scratch.

BTW its running great now, have only been tooting around but you can tell that everything is as it should be, i only need to go in and adjust the idle and bring it down a bit (currently at about 1500). Im seriously considering changing out to a t3 adaptor for the throttles, having them upside down would make idle adjustment so much easier.

[takai]

Ok, i missed the bit where you said you were running it all on a stock ECU.

Your MAP signal is basically useless with the quads and cams, the ECU will have to run off TPS only. The stock ECU will be able to cope to a degree, but hell it wont run very well. Im guessing with the bigger injectors its overfuelling at idle, and then running lean above.

[Joshstix]

It's a stock AFM setup, so it has some chance of knowing what is going on with airflow but no idea what kind of timing curve to be running.

[oldcorollas]

seems odd that just having the injectors wired 1/2 and 3/4 instead of 1/4 and 2/3 should make such a difference?

i know with my MS stuff you can run as batch fire (all 4 at once) or alternating, and you can change the number of injector firings per engine cycle...
at idle it makes a little bit of difference, but not massive difference, and make almost no difference during normal running.

the injectors are not synced to the valve timings (ie, not sequential) and are aimed at the valvs anyway, so i find it strange that just the order of injection made a difference...

th einjectors weren't accidentally wired in serial rather than parallel?

[DeftAnesthetik]

seems odd that just having the injectors wired 1/2 and 3/4 instead of 1/4 and 2/3 should make such a difference?

i know with my MS stuff you can run as batch fire (all 4 at once) or alternating, and you can change the number of injector firings per engine cycle...
at idle it makes a little bit of difference, but not massive difference, and make almost no difference during normal running.

the injectors are not synced to the valve timings (ie, not sequential) and are aimed at the valvs anyway, so i find it strange that just the order of injection made a difference...

th einjectors weren't accidentally wired in serial rather than parallel?

No, Im pretty sure the injectors are wired in parallel, I just went back about 16" on the loom from the injectors and wired in the connectors i scavenged off a silvertop harness (really nice and neat with the plastic cover)..... its one of those things that should have took me forever to find but out of coincidence i was looking at the BGB and seen Injectors 1 & 3, 2 & 4, are paired but remembered wiring them paired 1 & 2, 3 & 4. To be sure i pulled out the multimeter and tested continuity.... the rest of the story has already been told.

Im ABSOLUTELY sure the stock ecu is hindering the performance of this setup, and also im sure im going to have to fiddle with the timing (running something other than 10 degree base) to get the most i can from the stock step. I took the beast out last night to cruise and am not entirely impressed, by only the "seat of my pants" comparison it seems that i had more power with stock cams and injectors running quads..... im not entirely sure that running a bigger intake cam is the best solution for NA. Again i know i have some tweaking to do before I commit to that statement but as it sits the power output is pretty flat.

I will be messing around with what i can this week and see what kind of results I can get. I might just break down and put the autronic in..... or swap the cams/reshim/retime etc... and see what happens then. I might check on pricing an AutoTune addition to the autronic so that i can do most if not all the tuning myself...it may work out cheaper than what a tuner costs..... again thanks for all input.

[takai]

Quads and stock ecu is a recipe for disaster. The airflow needed across the rev range is completely different.