aw11 oversteer. quickie q's

[DeftAnesthetik]

been driving for a while and have been getting more and more comfortable with pushing the car, and i'm enjoying every minute of it. recently due to my pushing i have noticed that my "2" is oversteering just enough to start bugging me. im running an 86 sunroof NA, there is no rear sway bar, though my struts have the tabs to mount. will adding a rear swaybar take out some of the oversteer? or should i just tough it out, practice and adjust my driving to suit?

what are some of my options to dial out the oversteer?

[stidnam]

I remember when I had my supercharged aw11 it had front and rear sway bars and strut braces as well as TRD springs and some crazy 10 way adjustable shocks. When that thing wasn't oversteering it was understeering and crazy dangerous in the wet.

When you say your getting oversteer, under what kind of driving conditions? Spirited driving up a windey road or flat in second through a sharp right hander ? I must admit if its overstear at speed then that can be pretty damn scary in a 2.

What kind of shocks and springs are you running as well?

[Mr Revhead]

driving style is the big thing
adding a rear bar will stiffen the rear increasing oversteer.

good springs and shocks and TYRES.
but also what are you asking it to do?
think about the weight transfer when you corner and whats its doing

or maybe your just a nut going to fast

[deviant]

Good quality tyres on an AW11 are a must!

As mentioned it also depends on what you are asking the car to do...

Is it power oversteer (flooring it mid corner and havnig the tail come round)?

Is it roll oversteer (where the tail comes round through carrying to much speed in to a corner)?

Is it lift off oversteer (pushing on round a corner and then suddenly backing off the throttle or braking)?

Are you trailing the brakes (still braking while turning)?

you need to be smooooooth and accurate with an MR2. Remember to that the cars balance is very good and has high limits even in stock form...but the higher the limits of a car the less warning you get of impending disaster and the quicker it can bite you!

[Duk]

Also, what sought of rear camber and toe angles do you run?
I run 2.5 degrees negative camber and about an 1/8 of an inch (stupid american wheel alignment machine ) toe in and the back of my car is quite planted (quite BORING ).
Others (TOOF I reckon) run with plenty negative camber but use toe out to keep the back end lively but that would probably slay your rear tyres inside edge.

Remember, smooth is fast, ruff is being a Holden driver

Have fun, I know I will

[deviant]

Yep from memory TooF is running some seriously aggressive settings so his car is really nimble at lower speeds.
Down side to such aggressive settings is massive tyre wear and twitchy handling at high speed.

Also TooF is running the RT615 (iirc) tyre which is a high end road tyre that verges on being a semi slick and as such benefit from having the settings he uses. Use the wrong settings for your tyre and you will just scrub the crap out of it and overheat it.

[Matt-AE86]

Driving Adsport's AW11 now and then I found when It didn't have the best setup and best tyres, if you took your foot of the accel while cornering drasticly it would want to go into a crazy oversteer almost spin. So I just used moderate steering. But once he got Coilovers and a few other things aswell as good tyres, the car felt great.

I havent driven it for a long time since, and he got the new wheels (15x8 0 offset) and hte wide body, and I don't think I got to drive it like that.

Have also driven my mates AW11 N/A on a motorkhana track and I found it to be an awsome car to use. Lift off is awsome fun. Just kept it flat chat, turn in on the lift off, and put the foot back in, was great for cornering.

Just my 2cent's. I wanted to buy one for awhile, but ended up doing other things.

[GUN METAL]

More Info On Current Set Up Required !!!

But Here A Basic List

1) Dont "lift Off" During Cornering

2) Check All The Suspension Alignments And Dampers Etc

3)does The Car Have A Front Swaybar.........just Checking, This Can Make It Very Interesting Indeed

4) Quality Tyres And Correct Air Pressures Crap Rear Tyres And Or Low Inflation Pressures Promote Oversteer

5) Check Rear Spring Rates Higer At The Rear Equals More Oversteer

6) Check Rear Is Not Toe Out (take Note Toof Hahahahaha)

7) Driving Style, Be Gentle With It, If You Are A Ham Fisted Wanker It Will Be Sure To Bite !!!

There Is A Truck Load Of Other Stuff But I Am Stuffed If I Am Going To Correct All These Freaking Caps Hahahahaha :d

[trdee]

you have to remember that the AW11 is always gonna be more twitchy than most cars at speed. As I told my dad; if you don't like the way it drives, change your driving style or gtfo of my car

[DeftAnesthetik]

koni sport inserts and intrax springs, i do have a front swaybar and have uprgraded endlinks from twosrus....... it is winter here and that may have something to do with me sliding around. i will be toughing it out and adapting my driving, i quite like the way the car drives right now, i think i need to make my shocks a little firmer then they are set at, ive been playing with it for a while and it was good but as i am getting more aggressive driving so must my setup. thanks for the replies. you've all answered my question.

[GUN METAL]

Driving on low friction surface in an AW11 is allways going to be interesting.

So winter over there equals snow ????? or crappy winter tyres ???

No rear bar will equal more initial understeer and then subsequent oversteer will be even more interesting.

I have Adjustable konis, Eibach springs and whiteline adjuatable barss wound up to the max

Heres my first even drive on a skid pan, really i was just having some fun but on many other attemts they are still a very difficult car to balance.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LyCa_Njt71s

Rear weight distribution, low polar moment of inertia, short wheel base and rapid steering all conspire to a VERY responsive chassis that is heaps of fun to drive (thats why i love it) but also one that is very difficult to master (another reason why i love it !)

[Mooro]

That looks like fun Really illustrates how once an AW starts to get sideways it's already too late

[GUN METAL]

That looks like fund Really illustrates how once an AW starts to get sideways it's already too late

I pretty much agree with that, i know i dont have very skilled hands but i have been driving AW11s for 17 years in all different conditions.

Compared to say my 2006 Commo Ute (that you can drive sideways all day) it is the complete opposite,

Front heavy, slow steering High polar moment of inertia, long wheelbase, oh and less power at the wheels !!

So its good for what its designed for but its not fun to drive even empty with the LSD

sure its easier to live with but its just not FUN !

[nick.parker]

When that thing wasn't oversteering it was understeering and crazy dangerous in the wet.

Ayet! AW11 = drive it slower in the wet than an 80 year Granny with a walking frame.

One time I was accelerating away from a corner onto a STRAIGHT 100kph road, with low/moderate acceleration, got to 60kph in 3rd (was a 100kph stretch), and the revs started floating up to about 5k, I was thinking WTF, has the clutch failed, for about 1.5 seconds till I realised the car was slightly off line, I promptly halved the throttle when I realised what was happening and the car gently nudged itself back into line....must have been a diesel / oil spill I think (or cow shit I suppose).

I have been wondering lately (disclaimer :: I have NO REAL KNOWLEDGE of supension) if the Corolla AE101 or other) setup with its lower arms + MAC strut, could be adapted to the MR2 rear. I think it would mostly solve the bushing compliance problem I seem to have. People tell my they can see my rear toe change a fair bit when I gas it in my car (17+psi boost). And if I grab the wheel, I can move it around a fair bit due to the poly bushings compliance (and the way in which bushing are using in the aw11 suspension).

I have seen on two-brutal that a dude put an 1993+ MK2 subframe into an AW11, but that was some fairly major surgery.

Maybe nothing short of lengthening the wheelbase of the AW11 1ft would help with over steer control. Parked next to my mates MX5, my mate laughed, noting the MR2's wheel base is even shorter than his MX5's!

Nick.

PS: Best sides driving car I ever had (on loose stones) was my old 1982 Hi-Ace! You could drive along indefinitely fishtailing using some clumsy throttle/steering wheel input.

[adamaw11]

There's a few different kinds of oversteer, I guess it depends in what situation your getting it, and when you want to reduce it. Is it in the wet under power that your worried about?,
or while braking hard driving down a hill (about the worst situation I can think of).
-or at 130kmh on a bumpy sweeping corner (on the track)

camber can help, as has been mentioned.

I found my battery relocation to the front (and other weight adjustment things) helped noticably for wet skidpan motorkhanas - it sort of actually increased power oversteer, but made it more controllable, and made made the open diff more noticable (was spinning one wheel more often)

Contrary to widespread belief, it is possible and easy enough(but not that easy) to hold an aw11 a bit sideways safely for a few seconds - only at low speeds in first gear though. As speed increases, it gets waaay harder to control very quickly.

I'm curious if anyones got big differences from using a big wing on the back.

Gun Metal, do you reckon your evo wing made any difference?