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Thread: 1JZ / 2JZ into MA61 / MZ10 Guide.

  1. #1
    Junior Member Grease Monkey Joorsh's Avatar
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    Default 1JZ / 2JZ into MA61 / MZ10 Guide.

    I wasn't going to do anything fancy here. Basically just write a list of the problems I encountered putting a 2JZGTE into my MA61, to hopefully make it easier for anyone else thinking about it. I'm pretty sure most of this stuff will also apply to the 1JZGTE, but feel free to correct me if anything differs. I'm almost certain I've forgotten some things too, so please, everyone post any problems you've had too. The idea of this is to help anyone who is silly enough to attempt this conversion :-P

    *) Find a front sump. The 1J/2J engine won't clear the crossmember with the standard sump, so you'll need to switch the standard sump with a front sump - I believe the chaser's and aristo's had them, but not 100% sure on that.

    *) Change the timing belt, drive belt, water pump, sparks plugs, thermostat, and anything else that looks munted or old. Make sure you do it before you put the engine in the car! If you can't afford to change any of these items, then you shouldn't be doing a damn engine conversion! If you can, change the front main, rear main and cam seals too.

    *) If you have an engine vibration dampener, remove it. You will also need to angle-grind the mount that it sits on, right back to the crossmember. Not all MA61's had this vibration dampener thing. If you're not sure what to look for, then pull the engine out of the car. Once the engine is out, it'll be the thing sitting in the middle of your engine bay that looks like a penis.
    No, really, I'm not kidding.

    *) You will need new engine mounts (duh). Bonneville (spelling?) is good enough, though some adjustements may be required (the oil line for the turbo's fouled, so I had to enlarge the opening on the engine mount - again, the angle grinder is your friend)

    *) You will need to adjust your throttle cable. It won't be long enough. You may also need to fab up a mount to hold the throttle cable properly if you want to pass engineering.

    *) You'll need to get a new high-pressure power steering line made up (the one that runs to the rack).

    *) The exhaust dumps will need to be made (obviously). Just make sure you get someone with half a clue to do it because it's a tight fit, and you don't want to end up cooking steering racks or fluids. I got mine done by Charlstone Exhaust and it's a stainless work of art for only $300. Can't say enough good things about the old fella there.

    *) The 2J ECU can be squeezed in behind the glovebox and it's a damn tight fight. Some persuading is definitely required. The loom can also be fit through the standard firewall hole, but you need to remove the ruuber grommet altogether, and even so it's a damn tight fit - but possible.

    *) If you want aircon, you will need to have metal lines fabricated to go to and from the compressor. All other lines should be OK.

    *) You'll need a front mount intercooler. There are 2 little triangular holes down the bottom in each corner near the radiator, covered by a little triangle of sheet metal. Tap out the three spot welds holding the sheet metal in, and this opens up the perfect holes for intercooler pipework.

    *) Depending on how you do your intercooler pipes, you may need to relocate your battery. That, or get a mini drycell battery (Optima or Odyssey are good - I went with Odyssey and couldn't be happier).

    *) An oil cooler is a good idea. There should be plenty of room in either one of the guards, though the pessenger side is probably your least crowded & best bet (the drivers side is a good one to use as a CAI).

    *) Get a power steering cooler. Nothing flash - just pilfer one off a crown or something. Make sure you don't hook it up in line with the pressurised side! If you don't get a power steering cooler, budget for buying a new steering rack every 6-12 months.

    *) You will need a gearbox bellhousing. If you're going with the standard MA61 W58 gearbox or late model supra W58 gearbox, the bellhousing you need is off an n/a JZA80. If you're going with the R154, you need the JZA70 bellhousing.
    And if you're crazy enough to go the V160/161 option (Though who in their right mind would be that nuts, Norbie?), you'll need to get a great big friggin hole cut out of your floorpan to fit the damn thing.

    *) The tailshaft should still fit provided your car was manual. Don't expect it to last too long if you want to thrash it though. Same applies for the diff.
    Tuetrac is your friend.

    *) You can either get a custom clutch/flywheel made up, or just use the N/A JZA80 one. Be warned - the N/A clutch will not last long unless you get a tough aftermarket one! Button is recommended.

    *) You will need a taco converter for your dash to be fully functional. Sideshow can hook you up with one of these for like $30.

    *) Cut the traction control butterfly out of the throttle body. It's a waste of time and a minor restriction. Make sure you plug the holes properly. The car will run perfectly on the standard ECU without it. The car will still operate perfectly if you choose to leave the butterfly in, too.

    *) Heat shield your turbo's and clutch/brake master cyls. Otherwise they'll get cooked from the heat VERY quickly. The 2J twin turbo's make quite a bit more heat than the old 5M :-P

    *) Get a triple core radiator if you want to give your car some stick.

    *) The standard 2J clutch fan is absoltuely fine. It doesn't catch on anything, and cools very, very well. If you're one of those people that obsess over every 0.1% loss of power, then you'll be wanting some AU falcon thermo fans. Be warned - these won't cool quite as well as the clutch fan, but should still be more than adequate. If you want to get engineered, you will need to butcher a fan shroud to fit. This applies for both the thermo and clutch fan options.

    *) You will need new fuel lines, and also to fab up a mount for a fuel filter. Don't bloody cut corners here! It's kind of important.

    *) If you want to pass engineering, you'll also need an unleaded fuel filler for the petrol tank.

    Well, that's it for now. I know it's not everything, but I'll add more as I remember. I also have pictures to illustrate literally every single one of these points, so if any of this is unclear let me know and I'll attach pics.

    -J-
    Last edited by Joorsh; 01-02-2006 at 01:35 PM.

  2. #2
    Teh Massif Dong Carport Converter BlackSupra's Avatar
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    Default Re: 1J/2J MA61 Guide.

    Quote Originally Posted by Joorsh

    *) The standard 2J clutch fan is absoltuely fine. It doesn't catch on anything, and cools very, very well. If you're one of those people that obsess over every 0.1% loss of power, then you'll be wanting some AU falcon thermo fans. Be warned - these won't cool quite as well as the clutch fan, but should still be more than adequate. If you want to get engineered, you will need to butcher a fan shroud to fit. This applies for both the thermo and clutch fan options.

    -J-
    With the exception of your radiator!

    Might also want to add that since you have now overpowered your 20 year old supra, you might want to also invest in new springs, shocks, bushes and upgrade the brakes.

    Rep for you.

  3. #3
    I make people cry Chief Engine Builder Draven's Avatar
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    Default Re: 1J/2J MA61 Guide.

    note: depending on dia of i/c piping and size of said triple core radiator, the ic piping may not fit through those convenient little triangles (mine didn't)
    http://www.toymods.org.au/forums/showthread.php?t=7465
    Quote Originally Posted by xero View Post
    and of course campbell newman's completely fucking everything he touches so badly that he should be called dick fingers.

  4. #4
    Current UZA80 owner Chief Engine Builder JustCallMeOrlando's Avatar
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    Default Re: 1J/2J MA61 Guide.

    RA65 power steering lines are useful as they go down the correct side of the engine, unlike the factory ones.
    Teh UZA80 - Project Century - Remotely p00'd by association

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    Today Im a Domestic Engineer Enchanter's Avatar
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    Default Re: 1J/2J MA61 Guide.

    Excellent list there. Most of it make perfect sense but why new fuel lines ?

    Cheers, Tim

  6. #6
    Is a Chief Engine Builder wilbo666's Avatar
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    Default Re: 1J/2J MA61 Guide.

    Quote Originally Posted by Joorsh
    *) Find a front sump. The 1J/2J engine won't clear the crossmember with the standard sump, so you'll need to switch the standard sump with a front sump - I believe the chasers and aristo's had them, but not 100% sure on that.
    Yep, JZX81, JZX90, JZX91, and JZS147 are also front sump. Also bear in mind that the dipsticks are different between front and midrear sumps (no idea about mid). A mid-rear dipstick in a front sump will read incorrectly.

    Further to that the JZS147 dipstick requires some slight bending to make it fit (due to the differ 1JZ vs. 2JZ inlet manifold which it bolts too).

    Quote Originally Posted by Joorsh
    *) You will need to adjust your throttle cable. It won't be long enough. You may also need to fab up a mount to hold the throttle cable properly if you want to pass engineering.
    y MA61 throttle cable was flat out not long enough. The cable from the front cut should work, however if you do not have one I used one from a common FWD Camry (90ish model) that is very long and fits (and is cheap) It connects to the 1/2JZ bracket correctly.

    Quote Originally Posted by Joorsh
    *) You'll need to get a new high-pressure power steering line made up (the one that runs to the rack).
    As JCMF says RA65 and RT142 have the PS mounted on the other side from factory and have a very nice set of metal lines that can be fixed to the crossmember with simple brackets. The hose connects to the 1/2JZ PS pump perfectly. Cheapest PS lines ever. The RA65 PS res also bolts up with the drilling of 2 new holes and then using bolts/nuts to secure it in pretty well the stock MA61 position. You can then use a RA65/RT142 low pressure PS res to pump hose

    Quote Originally Posted by Joorsh
    *) The 2J ECU can be squeezed in behind the glove box and it's a damn tight fight. Some persuading is definitely required. The loom can also be fit through the standard firewall hole, but you need to remove the rubber grommet altogether, and even so it's a damn tight fit - but possible.
    I fitted mine underneath the glove box with little drama (as opposed to behind it).

    Quote Originally Posted by Joorsh
    *) If you want aircon, you will need to have metal lines fabricated to go to and from the compressor. All other lines should be OK.
    I have heard that if you get the moulting section top off a 7m AC compressor the stock MA61 lines can then be used. I haven't confirmed this...

    Quote Originally Posted by Joorsh
    *) You'll need a front mount intercooler. There are 2 little triangular holes down the bottom in each corner near the radiator, covered by a little triangle of sheet metal. Tap out the three spot welds holding the sheet metal in, and this opens up the perfect holes for intercooler pipe work.
    As draven suggests, the driverís side hole is actually quite small due to the radiator being offset. I enlarged slightly the hole where the stock MA61 PS cooler pipe goes and ran my IC pipes though that on the driverís side. On the passenger side I went via the triangle.

    My pipe is 2.5" (rubber )

    Quote Originally Posted by Joorsh
    *) Depending on how you do your intercooler pipes, you may need to relocate your battery. That, or get a mini drycell battery (Optima or Odyssey are good - I went with Odyssey and couldn't be happier).
    I didnít have to move my battery And it is a rather large one.

    Quote Originally Posted by Joorsh
    *) Get a power steering cooler. Nothing flash - just pilfer one off a crown or something. Make sure you don't hook it up in line with the pressurised side! If you don't get a power steering cooler, budget for buying a new steering rack every 6-12 months.
    I mounted mine in the spare space on the front passenger side; itís a MZ10 etc oil cooler, pretty common size.

    Quote Originally Posted by Joorsh
    *) You will need a gearbox bellhousing. If you're going with the standard MA61 W58 gearbox or late model supra W58 gearbox, the bellhousing you need is off an n/a JZA80. If you're going with the R154, you need the JZA70 bellhousing.
    And if you're crazy enough to go the V160/161 option (Though who in their right mind would be that nuts, Norbie?), you'll need to get a great big friggin hole cut out of your floorpan to fit the damn thing.
    If you do use an R154 using an auto MA61 gearbox crossmember and some slight bashing of the trans tunnel makes it bolt up apparently (obvs depends on engine mounts).

    Quote Originally Posted by Joorsh
    *) You will need a taco converter for your dash to be fully functional. Sideshow can hook you up with one of these for like $30.
    I have seen the stock 12v pk-pk tacho output signal work without a booster (Johal's car), I used the simple circuit that is floating around (gutted relay, transistor...).

    Quote Originally Posted by Joorsh
    *) You will need new fuel lines, and also to fab up a mount for a fuel filter. Don't bloody cut corners here! It's kind of important.
    I used a stock MA61 fuel filter, mounted with an SV21 Camry bracket bolted to the block with only one bolt. The stock MA61 line fits the fuel filter input, and a banjo->banjo hose is needed to connect to the 1JZ connection (at least on JZZ30). I sourced my banjo->banjo hose off a 90's EFI charade from memory.

    A few other things I can suggest.
    *RT142 Corona have the radiator overflow on the same bracket as the wiper bottle close to the windscreen (the stock MA61 wiper res position). You need to drill two holes and use bolts / nuts but it looks like it belongs and frees up space for the IC piping at the front.

    *For water hoses I used
    -Engine -> Rad (top hose): shortened (on engine side) JZZ30 top hose
    -Rad -> Engine (bottom hose): shortened (engine side) MX83 lower hose
    -Engine -> heatervalve: SA63 engine -> heatervalve hose
    -Engine -> heatercore: A section of straight hose cut to length

    I have pics of a fair few of these in my old members ride section...
    HERE

    Also letís not forget norbies site!

    Cheers
    Wilbo

  7. #7
    Current UZA80 owner Chief Engine Builder JustCallMeOrlando's Avatar
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    Default Re: 1J/2J MA61 Guide.

    Quote Originally Posted by wilbo666
    I have seen the stock 12v pk-pk tacho output signal work without a booster (Johal's car), I used the simple circuit that is floating around (gutted relay, transistor...).
    Johal's was originally an MTEU, which had the same sort of tacho output at the 1GGTE apparently. Thats why his works out of the box.
    Teh UZA80 - Project Century - Remotely p00'd by association

  8. #8
    Today Im a Domestic Engineer Enchanter's Avatar
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    Default Re: 1J/2J MA61 Guide.

    Quote Originally Posted by Joorsh
    *) You will need new fuel lines, and also to fab up a mount for a fuel filter. Don't bloody cut corners here! It's kind of important.
    Do you mean the metal lines from the tank or just the rubber ones in the engine bay ?

  9. #9
    Junior Member Grease Monkey Joorsh's Avatar
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    Default Re: 1J/2J MA61 Guide.

    Do you mean the metal lines from the tank or just the rubber ones in the engine bay ?
    Just the rubber ones. The metal lines go to the correct side, so it's all good.

    I have heard that if you get the moulting section top off a 7m AC compressor the stock MA61 lines can then be used. I haven't confirmed this...
    I had heard this as well, and gave it a try with no luck. The ac compressor tops are very different. Ah well.

    A few more things I thought of too. Though it's not so much of an issue for 1J conversions, when it comes to the 2J, it tends to generate drivetrain-breaking amounts of torque. A modified highlux tailshaft is probably the best bang for your buck, however custom 1-piece tailshaft is probably your best outright option.

    Be warned however. The MA61 was not designed with a 1-piece tailshaft in mind. Any kind of gearbox work means pulling off the crossmembers, tailshaft, AND diff just to get the damn gearbox out. and even exhaust in some cases, depending on how it was made up.

    You may also want to get your hands on some XR6 turbo heat shield material (this stuff is friggin awesome!), and use it to line your dump pipes where they pass the underside of the footwell. I found I was burning my feet on some of the footwell bolts till I put one in place.

  10. #10
    Toymods V8 Member Too Much Toyota CrUZida's Avatar
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    Default Re: 1J/2J MA61 Guide.

    Quote Originally Posted by wilbo666
    I have heard that if you get the moulting section top off a 7m AC compressor the stock MA61 lines can then be used. I haven't confirmed this...
    AFAIK this is for putting new motors in 7M equiped vehicles.

    ie, MX83 to JZX81 or UZX83.

    The MA61/MX73/MZ10 compressor is different, its an older style.


    Joorsh, change the title to 1J/2J MA61/MZ10 guide.
    Peewee
    1985 MZ12 Soarer - 1UZ Powered
    2013 86 GTS

  11. #11
    Today Im a Domestic Engineer Enchanter's Avatar
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    Default Re: 1JZ / 2JZ into MA61 / MZ10 Guide.

    So, if I was to convert my 5ME w58 MA61 to a 2JZGE the main things for me to consider are...

    Aristo front cut (Front sump)
    Modified crossmember and engine mounts
    Throttle cable (from front cut?)
    Power steering lines (RA65 or RT142)
    Aircon lines for the compressor
    NA JZA80 bellhousing, clutch and flywheel
    Tacho converter

    Hmm, it nice to have a list in front of you rather than try and keep one in your head

    Edit : Oh and does anyone know if the stock exhaust manifold will fit in the bay or do I need custom from the start ?

    Cheers, Tim

  12. #12
    Teh Massif Dong Carport Converter BlackSupra's Avatar
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    Default Re: 1JZ / 2JZ into MA61 / MZ10 Guide.

    Quote Originally Posted by Enchanter
    So, if I was to convert my 5ME w58 MA61 to a 2JZGE the main things for me to consider are...

    Aristo front cut (Front sump) -> Buy a motor package and swap on a front sump
    Modified crossmember and engine mounts -> bonneville automotive do these off the shelf $250 a set.
    Throttle cable (from front cut?) -> Factory MA61 one is fine for Non Turbo Conversion
    Power steering lines (RA65 or RT142)
    Aircon lines for the compressor
    NA JZA80 bellhousing, clutch and flywheel
    Tacho converter - > Black and white wire off the coil will hook straight up to the back of the MA61 dash for factory tacho love. (only works for GE, not GTE)

    Hmm, it nice to have a list in front of you rather than try and keep one in your head

    Edit : Oh and does anyone know if the stock exhaust manifold will fit in the bay or do I need custom from the start ?

    Cheers, Tim

    Just read the bold bits in the quote.

  13. #13
    Junior Member Backyard Mechanic 82MKII's Avatar
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    Default Re: 1J/2J MA61 Guide.

    Quote Originally Posted by wilbo666
    Yep, JZX81, JZX90, JZX91, and JZS147 are also front sump. Also bear in mind that the dipsticks are different between front and midrear sumps (no idea about mid). A mid-rear dipstick in a front sump will read incorrectly.
    Wilbo,
    any idea of the different dipstick lengths?
    When I bought my 1J it had been converted to front sump - and who knows if it has the right dipstick in it. I'll check it out tonight when I'm home again.

    Thanks

    Peter

  14. #14
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    Default Re: 1JZ / 2JZ into MA61 / MZ10 Guide.

    hey

    just called bonneville automotive, there now asking $300 per set, also as the guy (brian ?) said they are designed for m-series crossmembers - does anyone know if M crossmembers are the same as G crossmembers - as I am looking to do this swap into gz10 soarer

    cheers

    Tim
    Z10 Drift in the build !

  15. #15
    Toymods V8 Member Too Much Toyota CrUZida's Avatar
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    Default Re: 1JZ / 2JZ into MA61 / MZ10 Guide.

    Crossmembers are the same.
    Peewee
    1985 MZ12 Soarer - 1UZ Powered
    2013 86 GTS

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