OST Dyno Day # 3

[EldarO]

wouldn't a highflowed turbo increase its efficiency?

prior to the rebuild - I'm sure all Matt had done to his 7M was hi-flow turbo (now mine), aftermarket intercooler (same size cooler as me), 1UZ AFM and bigger injectors..

I think my motor has a lot more power potential - just something isn't right at the moment..

Damo
TRD83

i dunno man, its the only explanation i can come up with, that it wasnt enough boost to really push it and come on song.

from memory your AFR's were good, so i doubt the 1UZ AFM + injectors that matt was using would have made any difference.

but there is obviously something, whether it be exhaust, condition of the motor, previous (unknown) work, etc.etc.

like you said, there could be anything in there.

Eldar.O.

[Alien]

not enough boost? :| you know he was running 1.3bar right?
and the afm and injectors dont just make your afr 'correct' it increases your intake = increase power.

the question wasnt about his mixtures

[chris davey]

Damo: I think some of that figure can be attributed to the tune. I have never seen the AFR's on a dyno sheet come up from beyond 10 in the upper rev range.
Usually, they will be close to 14.7:1 at cruise, then as load increases slightly get richer to say 14:1 then as you boot it, they will head to 12:1 or so. Looking at the shape of the curve, I think you could decrease the boost threshold and make more power and torque down low if fuel was taken out.
Where did they place the sensor for boost? Is it possible that there was a boost leak? Do a search for boost leak as I put up a simple test for it.
I am no expert on 7m's and ct26's but even if highflowed I don't think it would be out of its efficiency range at 1.3 bar. I would tend to think it would close to its upper limits rather than lower limits.

Matty: I must make it clear that the large post I put up was not written by me. I found it and thought it was a very good physics test to see how 2 cars with vastly different hp and torque curves.
I sent it to my mate who is a physics teacher and told him that this was the first time I have seen physics put to good use

BTW I am an accountant

[Wildsupra]

Whine whine whine bitch bitch bitch.

To the track god dammit!!!!

Chris your still a cluey bloke

Matty

[JustCallMeOrlando]

Matt's car was as Damo described, a high-flow turbo bolted onto a stock engine, with an IC, 1UZ AFM and bigger injectors. What he also had which were the important bits was an S-AFC and an S-ITC. Leaning out slightly will have produced more power, but the rest of it would've come from timing. A byproduct of using the S-AFC to fool the ECU into thinking it's getting less air is that the ECU will also advance the timing.

I am pretty sure Matt wasn't even running as much boost as Damo was, so I don't think it's a problem with efficiency.

[Stomps]

Also, drags may be a good indicator of hp/ accel etc.. but its on the circuit that it really matters.. Best indicator of all round performance is not in a straight line..

Anyone who dissagrees with this statement should come down to Belmont Racecourse carpark this Sunday at 12. Watch a 67HP 18RC beat most of the field.

or watch a 1.6l n/a corolla with no more then an exhaust (as far as power goes) beat 300+ supras, silvias, WRX's round Barbagello.. Damo... **Track day hint hint**

Power is great, but suspension FTW!!

anyway enough of this 1j vs 7m crap, there is enough of it going on in the supra/ soarer thread, they are both good motors..

Stomps

[WA_TRD_83]

Matt's car was as Damo described, a high-flow turbo bolted onto a stock engine, with an IC, 1UZ AFM and bigger injectors. What he also had which were the important bits was an S-AFC and an S-ITC. Leaning out slightly will have produced more power, but the rest of it would've come from timing. A byproduct of using the S-AFC to fool the ECU into thinking it's getting less air is that the ECU will also advance the timing.

I am pretty sure Matt wasn't even running as much boost as Damo was, so I don't think it's a problem with efficiency.

I thought about a SAFC before.. even started a thread about it.. only to be told that the 7M AFM wouldn't work with a SAFC.. ?
maybe I have to get a 1UZ AFM ?

I think its still a case of the simple solutions are the best ... Chris is probably right - I still have boost leak somewhere.
I'll start with some stainless cooler piping and silicon joins and see if that helps.

Thanks for the feedback

Damo
TRD83

[Stomps]

SAFC does work with 7m AFM, im running one.. Who told you it wouldnt..

The only issue with mine is that the readout was in reverse coz it was reading it backwards.. It still corrected fuel accordingly.. On the dyno you could see the mixtures being adjusted properly, but on the SAFC screen it was backwards ie when fuel was being taken away it showed a +'ve reading..

dunno why this happened, mick from Ovaboost said its like that on some supras he put it onto and not on others.. seems its a big mystery, but it does work..

Stomps

[hamgatan]

I thought about a SAFC before.. even started a thread about it.. only to be told that the 7M AFM wouldn't work with a SAFC.. ?

that is fcking bollocks. who told you that pile of shit?

even though the 1UZ AFM makes a nice upgrade to increase airflow, the S-AFC works perfectly fine with the 7M Karmann Vortex AFM, AND the MAP sensor AFM that was in the Turbo A. There are wiring maps for both types of AFM's and all you do is set it up in the S-AFC specific to what AFM you have. This was all in that wiring diagram i posted for you before mate


stomps, the only reason i can think of it reading backwards is that you had the wiring for the throttle signal around in reverse. like, you split the wire and connected it into the safc on the right wires, but you had it round the wrong way..

[CrUZida]

Umm, when using a 1UZ AFM, you still retain the 7M sensor (that black box on top).
Its just the 1UZ AFM housing that gets used.

[CrUZida]

Peewee made what his car makes?? is that right man?

Yeah Matty.
The first run was within 0.5hp comparing to when it got tuned.

Bump the air intake temps up 10deg, and it added about 6hp.

[JustCallMeOrlando]

Damo, you still think you have a boost leak? I'd have expected worse AFR's if you did, and 1.3 bar WITH a leak is a hefty amount.

[WA_TRD_83]

Damo, you still think you have a boost leak? I'd have expected worse AFR's if you did, and 1.3 bar WITH a leak is a hefty amount.

I'm just suprised at the significant lack of power for a car running 17psi - especially compared to Nigel's 7M running 8psi (stock boost) and getting 260hp!

its reading that at the boost gauge - but what the AFM reads and allows for? dunno
must be loosing it somewhere along the line for it to run so rich?

and the fact that my car runs such inconsistent boost too. thats the most confusing of all.. will have to get a Gizmo EBC

Damo

[JustCallMeOrlando]

That's not that rich dude.

[WA_TRD_83]

SAFC does work with 7m AFM, im running one.. Who told you it wouldnt..

Stomps

oops - sorry guys.. I read the posts again
( http://toymods.net/forums/showthread.php?t=13648 )

it wasn't the fact that it wouldn't work with the 7M ... was more a fact that it wouldn't be worth it once I buy it and get someone to install/tune it..
The money would be better spent on some sort of aftermarket ECU..

Unless I was to get Stomps old SAFC - which is already set up for 7MGTE .. ?
and he was willing to sell it for a reasonable price

Damo