2tg/3t hybrid - the next step?

[byrnziecelica]

Currently in my ta22, sits a 2tg/3t hybrid. A good friend of mine built the engine for me two years ago and has been taking it out and upgrading it as we went along. With almost everything strengthened, bored or forged, I'm starting to hit the max of the power outputs. She has a set of duel 40 webber carbies. Unfortunately my mate moved overseas

Can I supercharge/turbocharge this engine? What sort of hassels would I encounter? How much performance upgrade would they give?

[jonra23]

What is your compression ratio, that will be a reasonable indicator if forced induction is a viable option.

When you say max power outputs what sort of results are you after, strong street, max HP with no regard for low down torque?

regards
jon

[andurils_sheath]

Well theres a few routes you could take.

1. Turbo with the current carbies. It is possible to run turbo on webbers however they may need to be boxed up and retuned. Carby turbo setups i dont know much about however i know its possible. Also you may only be able to run low boost because chances are you have fairly high compression therefore hi boost would result in pinging.

2. You could convert to efi, there are some 2t-geu manifolds looms and ecus floating around for resonable prices. This can be combined with a custom ecu for better tunability. This would be a sensible option if you are wishing to turbo, aswell as lowering the compression of your pistons via some custom forgies. Im guessing you already have forgies judging by the bore comment. It is possible to get hi or low comp pistons, eg. paradise racing in the usa has some reasonably priced forgies for a 2t/3tg.

3. efihardware in mitcham, vic. has a bolt on quad throttle kit for a webber manifold which would give great tunability, prolly not much of an increase in power over the webers, however fuel efficency would be increased and efi seems to be the way of the future.

Just some food for thought.
Cheers

[byrnziecelica]

To be perfectly honest my knowledge in this is fairly low. It does have forged pistons and judging by your comments this means it's running high compression forgies because of the carby's?

I wouldnt mind going down the road of 4sfed ( a black ta22) that had a supercharger from a 4A-GZE strapped to a 2tgeu that was internally standard. Would my engine, judging by the amount of work that has been done to it, the hybrid with the 3t as well as a lot of other bits and pieces run quite nicely with a supercharger? I don't mean to sound stupid but I'd perfer the sound of the supercharger over a turbo charger. As much as I'd like a power upgrade, this car has been built primarily for show then speed. Saving some money on fuel wouldnt hurt either. Putting the foot down with the current setup can be costly.

Although unsure of the amount of work this would take.. as well as how much money ...

[andurils_sheath]

Hi,

Chances are if you arent running FI, then youre running hi comp, because hi comp on an NA car will give power gains over low comp.

Runnning a supercharger can be done however it may become expensive as an EFI upgrade is almost a necessity along with the cost of the brackets and pulleys etc. lowering the comp although not totally necessary would reap benefits as more boost can be run from different sized pulleys etc.

So it would almost be cheaper to just grab a 3t-gte turbo manifold as this should bolt on. A turbo and efi gear, new pistons. This will have similar effects as the mods required for the supercharger upgrade however you can acheive far greater power from the turbo for similar cost to the super upgrade. Also when you get sick of the current power, simply winding the boost up and getting a retune will result in increased power.

Cheers.

[ace]

If this TA22 is built for show then why isn't it in the members ride section? Cmon, Pics!

[byrnziecelica]

Just to let you know man. just for u...i posted some pics

[RT104GT]

Currently in my ta22, sits a 2tg/3t hybrid. A good friend of mine built the engine for me two years ago and has been taking it out and upgrading it as we went along. With almost everything strengthened, bored or forged, I'm starting to hit the max of the power outputs. She has a set of duel 40 webber carbies. Unfortunately my mate moved overseas

Can I supercharge/turbocharge this engine? What sort of hassels would I encounter? How much performance upgrade would they give?

Its already been done its called a 3TGTE and they develope 165 hp.

[byrnziecelica]

Do you think after building this engine i'd change it for the 3tgte? Do you think that'd serve much purpose? There are big differences in the hybrid and the 3tgte... I was being specific and asking for advice. Not needing a responce telling me its already been done.

Currently the 2t/3t is running about 170hp NA. Think I should just change it for the 3tgte? Or were you commenting that they brought out the engine as a 3tgte? People above were helpful in giving me a responce that I could use. You did not.

Thanks for the update though mate.

[jonra23]

If you are running compresion ratios higher than stock which it sounds like you probably are turbocharging is probably a better option than supercharging.

With reasonable compression you will be fairly limited to to the amount of boost htat you can run especialy lower in the rev range, high compresion + boost + wide open throttle + low revs will lead to detonation issues.

WIth a turbo you will be making less boost at low to medium revs than with a supercharger, also with a progamable boost controller you can tailor the boost rise in a turbo system where it is difficult/fairly inneficient to bleed of volume in a supercharger system. Then higher in the rev range where you can handle the boost the efficiency of a supercharger is starting to drop off.

Dont get me wrong I actualy favour superchargers for street use, but whole power package needs to built with forced induction in mind to get good results from them.

regards
jon

[Rodger]

Jon

Can I ask?

What are the current specs that you know?

There are possiblities to gain another few minor HP with what you have. Mind you 170BHP is bloody good.

I reckon, the more cost effective option for you now is to go the forced induction low compression route, as any more HP from this NA set up will cost more for less gain than another motor.

Regards

Rodger

[byrnziecelica]

Yeah thats what i think im going to do. 170 hp NA is pretty much everything at this stage i could get out of this engine. My main question was whether to go down the route of 4sfed (tim's original engine) which had a supercharger from the 4AGZE or to take the turbo and manifold from a 3tgte.

I like the idea of superchargers for street use as well as the fact that it's something different.

I'll get compression ratios and some more details this afternoon and post them

[suss_slide]

my sweet jesus, your gettin 170 HP from a 2tg/3t hybrid????!???!!?!? :O dude thats an amazing feat in itself i say keep it like that, but if you want turbo i assume your going to have to lower the compression so the engine doesnt blow up, thats about all i know myself, and for easier tuning change it to EFI.

good luck and get some pics

[Rinmax]

I have a hybrid that is running around the 170hp mark and that is with higher than normal compression. If you have that power NA, then without putting in a spacer I wouldn't even think of forced induction. How's about some pics or possibly a dyno run sheet (just so I can compair ). If you really want to go forced induction then the 3T-GTE would be a much better starting point. Not to mention a 170hp 2TG would get good money around here.

Just my two cents worth

[suss_slide]

where is it ?? i dont see it in your little list, ohhh you lucky buggers i wish i had a 100 hp enegine let alone 170, one question maximum rim, does the engine run smoothly, i would imagine with the cams and the compression it would be fair rough??