Intercooler setups

[kingmick]

Yes you can but the calculation is hit and miss. i could look at the inside of a core and tell you a more acurate pressure drop.
There is a very good reason they do practical test after they do formula's, to see if there right!hahahahahahahahaha
I love formulation and i love experiance from the practical side.

[mic*]

[IMG][/IMG]

These two coolers have the same frontal area. Same heat transfer area. Same efficiency (measure of ability to change charge air temp back to cooling air temp).

The bottom one has less pressure loss becuase it has more tubes - ie more charge air face and/or internal area.

I know which one Id pick.

EDIT: THE BOTTOM ONE!

[kingmick]

thats pretty easy even for someone that only has half an idea! i know which id PICK 1ST

[YelloRolla]

i could look at the inside of a core and tell you a more acurate pressure drop.

Of course you can. I expect no less!

There is a very good reason they do practical test after they do formula's, to see if there right

corrections = formulae and they're

This is actually arse about face, so to speak, there is a reason why the do the calculations FIRST and then do a practical test. To help minimize the amount of time doing testing. Of course I don't know why formulae are important to you? As you can tell by looking.

With all racing, the fastest car will be the one with the best series of compromises.

[mic*]

thats pretty easy even for someone that only has half an idea! i know which id PICK 1ST

Thats pretty funny you say that then when nearly every core i see on the ROAD is horizontal, ie long channels vs charge area.

Pretty poor given that most of them were probably sold on some sort of "race design" premise. Dont you think.

[YelloRolla]

I actually have had both designs on my car.
I like my current set up more. The intercooler cores in question were - set up 1) 2 x RX-7 intercoolers joined in parallel (ie short runs large end tanks). Set up 2) as you see it in the photo to the left.
I like the second one more, as it has better piping, even though they are a little large at 63mm with 1.6mm wall for easier fitment of the GT30, and better end tanks (hand beaten aluminium).
It is also a superior designed core where the fins are cut flush with the end plates internally helping to minimize turbulence of air entering the cooling tubes. It also flows better, as the turbulators are not impinging so much into the charge air.

I also recognise the image as being from Maximum Boost.

[kingmick]

With all racing, the fastest car will be the one with the best series of compromises.

He with the most money and knowledge can minimise the compromise more

[kingmick]

Thats pretty funny you say that then when nearly every core i see on the ROAD is horizontal, ie long channels vs charge area.

Pretty poor given that most of them were probably sold on some sort of "race design" premise. Dont you think.

Your not serious right? you having a joke right? im giving you a chance to get out of it ,right!
I will make it simple, if i put a legth of hose out in the sun and have running whater threw it, on short one long, which will have the hottest water at the end?

[jonra23]

It is not quite that simple, 1 hose with different lengths will give different temps.

Different number of hoses at different lenghts flowing the same volume =????

With both intercoolers pictured above on same engine at same speed the air will stay in the intercooler for exactly the same time period so has potentail for same heat transfer.

As heat is only transfered out of the intercooler through the wall of the tubes there can be huge differences in same size/shape core depending on tube size, fin density, turbulator design, end tank design (does it spread flow evenly across tubes) etc.

regards
jon

[kingmick]

OK before eveyone gets carried away with this, there is a simple fomula for a good intercooler!
Pick the right core, get the core as light as it can be and hold 30-50% over the boost you are going to use, have the right shaped SIDE endtanks with deflectors in them, have nothing infront of the airflow to the said core when mounted in the car and angle the cooler as much as you have the room to do it.
Now show me a formula with all that worked out with math and ill get you a job in a formula 1 team.
lmao

[kingmick]

It is not quite that simple, 1 hose with different lengths will give different temps.

Different number of hoses at different lenghts flowing the same volume =????

With both intercoolers pictured above on same engine at same speed the air will stay in the intercooler for exactly the same time period so has potentail for same heat transfer.

As heat is only transfered out of the intercooler through the wall of the tubes there can be huge differences in same size/shape core depending on tube size, fin density, turbulator design, end tank design (does it spread flow evenly across tubes) etc.

regards
jon

shakes head and walks away, why try to put square edges on a round wheel?

Now read what i said again and see the openness with regard to trade secrets, that i never ever give to people that carry one and try and make a mountian out of a mole hill, because i get a laugh out of them trying to get the best out of the mountain. hahahahaha

[UMP-man]

OK before eveyone gets carried away with this, there is a simple fomula for a good intercooler!
Pick the right core, get the core as light as it can be and hold 30-50% over the boost you are going to use, have the right shaped SIDE endtanks with deflectors in them, have nothing infront of the airflow to the said core when mounted in the car and angle the cooler as much as you have the room to do it.
Now show me a formula with all that worked out with math and ill get you a job in a formula 1 team.
lmao

i like your forumla.
the chinese character looking things made no sense to me.

[jonra23]

shakes head and walks away, why try to put square edges on a round wheel?

Now read what i said again and see the openness with regard to trade secrets, that i never ever give to people that carry one and try and make a mountian out of a mole hill, because i get a laugh out of them trying to get the best out of the mountain. hahahahaha

Now I am confused.

I was not trying to give you a hard time, i agree with the post that you were obviously writing the the same time as i was writing mine about it being pretty much impossible to work it out with a formula, also what i was trying to say.

BUT, i have no idea what this post above means in the language i read and write in.

regards
jon

[kingmick]

two equal diameter hoses with the same water pressure in the sun with one being double the length of the other, which one will have the hottest water at the end?

[jonra23]

Yes i understand that bit, and that post.

But;
One hose at one length against two hoses at a different length flowing the same volume over a given time =???.

Too many variables as you said in the other post.

The two intercooler pics have different number of tubes as well as different length of tubes.

I just couldn't undersatnd the post that i quoted at all.