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Thread: small port or big port 4age for turbo setup?

  1. #1
    Forum Member 1st year Apprentice
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    Default small port or big port 4age for turbo setup?

    hi guys im building a 16v 4age turbo engine for my AE86 and i have heard mixed responses as to what is the most suitable head to use in this build. i am not looking to make any more than say 160kw max i would be happy to just have 120-130kw and i have at my disposal a running small port out of an AE93 with orange/red writing on the rocker cover and black writing where it says "toyota 1600" and i have a gze block and head im unsure if the gze head is a small port or big port. my query is what is better for a turbo setup, big or small port???

  2. #2
    Learner / modder / Backyard Mechanic PrettyCoolWagon's Avatar
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    Default Re: small port or big port 4age for turbo setup?

    Hi Luke,

    I think the real question you might want to answer is What do I want from my car? & How do I want it to perform.

    A lot of people swear by the smallport, & it was toyota's improvement on the 1st generation bigport TVIS system. So those toyota engineers probably knew what they were doing...

    Those in favour of big ports generally speak about having top end torque & power.

    So if you do a lot of street driving small port will be better & your turbo will take care of grunt when your on the highways & freeways.

    Having said that, you'll need to consider what size of turbo.
    smaller = less lag.
    bigger = more lag but better top end highway/freeway response.

    The general consensus is the gze block is the best for turbo charging. It's much stronger than a standard 4age block.
    If you post some pics up of your gze, people will be able to tell you whether it's big or small port.
    Unless you know what year / model of car it came from?
    Do you know if it's AFM or MAP sensored?
    OR
    Remove your intakes on both engines & measure the widest point of each intake port & compare... You already know that your running engine is a small port, so your GZE's gonna be either the same size (small port) or bigger (big port)

    Here this might help also:

    http://www.billzilla.org/4agmods3.htm

    It's up to you how far you wanna go with it. Your capabilities, tools you have OR the depth of your wallet.

    Forum member: Terra Operative is well experienced with 4agze engines & sticks to supercharged applications.
    He recommends putting bigport cams in a small port head & using adjustable cams to get the most out of these engines.

    If indeed you end up having a big & a small port them you may want to try this option.

    I think one of the best things he ever said to me was "Make sure all your mod's work together"

    So your plenum/intake should be chosen with regard to the size of your turbo.
    The same goes for your intercooler.
    Then if your not already running extractors, you might like to give some consideration to what type of extractors you're going to run...

    Good luck
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  3. #3
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    Default Re: small port or big port 4age for turbo setup?

    thanks for the info PrettyCoolWagon the car will be a street driven car that will be lap sprinted from time to time as i love the way the car handles but majority of its driving will be street use, and i am going for a responsive (smaller) turbo and a small front mount intercooler set up whith the shortest possible amount of plumbing. to my knoweledge there is only four AE86's in Darwin and mine is the only road registered one at the moment and it is a real head turner and i dont want it to be all show and no go.

    by the way he gze came whithout a loom, computer, air box ect so im unsure of what sensors it has. i may just opt for the small port setup unless somebody can give me any other reasons not to.

  4. #4
    Junior Member Too Much Toyota oldcorollas's Avatar
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    Default Re: small port or big port 4age for turbo setup?

    small port.

    if the GZE is a big port, the intake ports will be bigger

    i mean, it's easy to tell cos they are noticably wider
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    Default Re: small port or big port 4age for turbo setup?

    well durr, i havnt pulled the running small port apart yet as it is my current daily untill my AE82 gets back from the shop after having all the bushes replaced and a full whiteline catalogue fitted and the rear disc brake up grades done. but im guessing from pics i have seen so far thats its a bigport. but only 1 way to find out i guess.

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    Junior Member Too Much Toyota oldcorollas's Avatar
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    Default Re: small port or big port 4age for turbo setup?

    measure the height and width of pics and compare the ratio to yours?
    "I'm a Teaspoon, not a mechanic"
    "There is hardly anything in the world that a man can not make a little worse and sell a little cheaper" - John Ruskin (1819 - 1900)

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    Junior Member Backyard Mechanic dangdang's Avatar
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    Default Re: small port or big port 4age for turbo setup?

    Use the smallport head IMO, has better casting in the ports and you can just use the N/A manifold which is much more superior to the rather constrictive GZE manifold with the dog leg.

    I had both a big and a small to choose from and I went smallport, meant I could do away with the bigport N/A tvis and I felt the smallport would give better responsiveness.

    I did use the bigport cams in the smallport head though, slightly more lift and slightly longer duration.

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    Default Re: small port or big port 4age for turbo setup?

    so it seems the general consensus is small port. as i suspected it was helpful to ask as i had no idea about running bigport cams so thanks guys for you help.

  9. #9
    Toymods Events Secretary Too Much Toyota trdee's Avatar
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    Default Re: small port or big port 4age for turbo setup?

    for the power you are after, a smallport indeed would be better. for higher applications i suspect a bigport with 1mm oversize valves would be the way to go, after speaking to some guys who have worked with both heads in the past here, but that is a fair way beyond the power levels you are hunting so never mind..
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    Olde mechanic Carport Converter oldeskewltoy's Avatar
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    Default Re: small port or big port 4age for turbo setup?

    Will you be getting the head ported?

    Yes, I am getting this head ported - matters less which one you use

    No, I was not planning on spending the money on a ported head - use the smallport
    Information is POWER... learn the facts!!

  11. #11
    Its hard being a Backyard Mechanic RT40Corona4AGTE's Avatar
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    Default Re: small port or big port 4age for turbo setup?

    +1 for OST comment above ^^^^^^
    1967 RT40 Corona Current Project - http://www.toymods.net/forums/showthread.php?t=46182

  12. #12
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    Default Re: small port or big port 4age for turbo setup?

    At that power level, the head choice will make little/no difference - just get one that's in good condition.
    Must.... avoid.... urge... to... upgrade... parts I haven't.... used.... yet.....

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    Junior Member Backyard Mechanic cri_ag's Avatar
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    Default Re: small port or big port 4age for turbo setup?

    Quote Originally Posted by PrettyCoolWagon View Post
    Hi Luke,



    The general consensus is the gze block is the best for turbo charging. It's much stronger than a standard 4age block.
    err, as far as i know there is zero difference between gze block and 4age blocks. pistons are different, but thats it. differences in blocks are in very early 3 rib 4age blocks, but most you will find are the stronger 7 rib, so the difference is in the age of the block not weather it was a gze or ge originally.

    keep your smallport, wander off to toyota, order gze pistons, fit to engine. turbo motor built.*





    *i may or may not have skipped a few steps....
    Last edited by cri_ag; 01-02-2011 at 12:08 PM.
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    Junior Member Too Much Toyota oldcorollas's Avatar
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    Default Re: small port or big port 4age for turbo setup?

    oil squirters...
    "I'm a Teaspoon, not a mechanic"
    "There is hardly anything in the world that a man can not make a little worse and sell a little cheaper" - John Ruskin (1819 - 1900)

    AU$TRALIA... come and stay and PAY and PAY!!! The moral high horse of the world!

  15. #15
    Junior Member Grease Monkey
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    Default Re: small port or big port 4age for turbo setup?

    Didn't the smallport 4AGE and 4AGZE both come with oil squirters?

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