1.5jz build.On a beer budget [hopefully]

[petespipes]

Thought it may be useful to share the tale of my experience and the costs involved in undertaking the budget build of a 1.5jzgte and lessons learned during.

costs will be foremost in this story as i believe if we had an unlimited budget we would simply grab a 6speed 2j front cut or hell,why not a new one plus a sparey!!!

This build started with purchase of a 2jzge motor complete less half the induction side.The na engine shares the same crank and rods as the gte.This motor was low k,s [evident from lack of bore wear] and at $400 it was great value considering it wore a starter motor,alternater,rear sump and air con gear.I was able to sell bits i didnt require and recoup $300.So far all good.

Next purchase was a set of 2jzgte stock pistons and rods,again $400.Many will say to simply use the na pistons as their are ample stories from the U.S. of power gained with na pistons.I didnt study this as I figured if Toyota considered they required both piston cooling oil squirters and forged pistons [stock 2jzgte] with their low factory boost,then I would use the better pistons.Its too hard to go oil squirters as that requires machining of the oil galleries.More about this later..[anyone looking for 2j pistons second hand please try Manny on this site]

With cleaning and close inspection of these items completed I decided to use the second hand rings and bearings that came with the piston set.The wear factor really was that low.The na block had zero bore lip.The pistons and bearing shells removed were lightly worn but still the turbo items showed considerably less wear.I expect to get adverse reaction to this but hey,watch the costs mount up ahead!

John Hill of JHH heads was recommended as the man that knows how to mate the 1j head to the 2j block so far as water cooling galleries and matching up thereof .I delivered a 1j head to John of unknown condition with a request to keep costs minimised,no porting etc.The head was found to be heat damaged [warped] and therefore needed attention and a freshen up.This was returned in a condition similiar to a fully recoed head,valve faces recut etc etc plus welding shut of a water gallery and machining open of another.Photos etc will not be available with respect to Johns work.Cost including supply of the required 2jzgte head gasket was $1100.I believe John knows his stuff and he assured me I could reuse both the head and crank bearing cap bolts so a further saving there.

Anyone not understanding the importance of correct water flow through a head need only inspect a stock toyota head gasket particularly the different sized holes in the water galleries to push the coolant where required.

Front and rear main seals plus cam seals were purchased through James of Castle Hill Toyota.Posted and recieved very next day to Brisbane.$150 approx posted.

Well if I have counted correctly that amounts to $1750 to date with many short cuts and more than a little luck.A long way to go yet.Next instalment soon.

Castle Hill Toyota free call 1800 111 388. [James Sloan]
JHH heads 07 32086274 [John Hill]
Manny [email protected] 2j pistons etc

Cheers.Pete.

[slide86]

so you are using pistons and rings that came out of one engine, and your putting them into another block. have you thought bout the ring gap difference, and the piston to bore clearance?

they might both be the same family of engine but there would be different amounts of wear. there might end up being to much or too little clearance there.....??

perhaps spending the cash in the first place will save you pulling the engine out when it goes through heaps of oil later down the track. i may be wrong, but i may also be right.

[petespipes]

Slide86 .yes fair comment.pistons od is same so i reckon its all good.I realise I am taking some risks but if i didnt it would not be a budget build.

Also consider the fact that most wrecker engines go in "as is" and many go the distance.At least I do know whats inside this engine.

I expect most will subscribe to your point of view.I accept that.

Cheers.Pete.

[EldarO]

$1750 so far, and thats budget.

really opens your eyes as to how expensive this stuff can get, real quick.

best of luck, ill be watching this thread

Eldar.O.

[1JZ.747]

goos thread pete. i understand what your were saying early on in your first post. i think if you are going to try and stay under 800 rwhp stay with a factory 2j.

will be good to see what the end product is and cost.

good luck mate.

oh


and what is your final goal once motor is in etc?

[Mr DOHC]

$1100 is a bit harsh, when u realise how much effort goes into the work, u realise thats a huge profit margin

["Z" UTE]

Head service including milling flat, around $600, it is after all a 24 valve head. Valve regrind gasket set circa $250, welding about $200.00, so no $1100.00 is not reallly bad.

That's the cost of engine building, it can skyrocket, as things go kerplunk.

cheers Chuck.

[Mr DOHC]

not when u have worked in the industry

[cambelt]

I think you will find 2jz-gte pistons are not forged and nether are 1j ones , they are a very high quality cast item , ceramic coated
Dave

[1JZ-Rolla]

not when u have worked in the industry

What's your point? That petespipes should have done a 4 year trade before doing the head service himself to save paying a profit to someone in the know? Or having been "in the industry", are you offering to do this sort of work for other people just for love & favours

Good work pete, keep us up to date Wonder if I can swing a 3L capacity past rego in the corolla?! ?

Cheers

[petespipes]

1jz747-Hi Shane.Goal is very modest but 25% more power than what I have.Street engine with early torque and 500 crank horsepower.I purchased a Garret GT30R early on based on Slylux's set up.He had 397 at the wheels with R154 which should mean around 500 crank.
At that time my ideas were based on a 1j.The 1.5j thing just happened when I came across the 2jzge at the right price.So most would use a GT35R but I am happy with going for less power and getting it lower in the rev range.Should have heaps of torque and boost as early as a stock 1j or close to it.

Cambelt1.yes have heard this before.some say stock 2j piston is an inferior forged item [to aftermarket] and others say its what you said.It looks to be a different material when comparing them side by side.Whatever it is its surely better than using the na piston.

I really didnt expect the head to go to $800 [withdrawing the head gaskets cost] but some of the expense there could have been avoided if i had presented a head in better condition.It was a dud head but it allowed me to keep a good spare engine and head in one piece so some value was retained there.

I think the useful comparison of costs is between 1.5j and 2j [obviously]but will a stock turbo 2jzgte do 500 crank horsepower? I realise 550cc injectors are about maxed out at this level.The reason I bring this up is because of the cost of the non standard turbo,wastegate,manifold etc.If both engines would require turbo upgrades to meet that power level then we are comparing the cost of the engines without all the turbo and management upgrade gear as they would be the same cost for both engines.

This would be the same for any power level both these engines could achieve up to the point where the 2j head started outflowing the 1j head I guess.[a contentious issue in itself]

[BigZ]

The cost of refurbishing the head sounds spot on the money as a friend of mine recently got charged pretty much an identical price for exact same work and the place was considered reputable and fairly priced. I've heard of stock turbo 2jzgte making close to 500bhp but with porting and cams which would be a given I suppose.

A well known work shop in Japan (cannot rember name) built a supra with a GT30 and the response was amazing think it was making 600bhp as tested by the "drift king" on best motoring (whats his name). Awsome project btw

[EldarO]

What's your point? That petespipes should have done a 4 year trade before doing the head service himself to save paying a profit to someone in the know? Or having been "in the industry", are you offering to do this sort of work for other people just for love & favours

Good work pete, keep us up to date Wonder if I can swing a 3L capacity past rego in the corolla?! ?

Cheers

i think he means to say that its the labour part of it that makes it expensive, no parts cost.

the majority of all work cost is in labour, and not parts.

so when you think about it, the people doing the head work didnt "spend much" money wise, they just spent alot of time on it, so while it didnt cost them much, its costing you because your paying them for their time.

then again, if you dont like the price, DIY.

Eldar.O.

[petespipes]

In regard to reusing Head bolts and similiar stuff its probably not very responsible of me to suggest it.The safe thing is always to use new bolts especially those that are TTY or torque to yield bolts that are meant to be one use only.

Rather than start a discussion on TTY bolts etc which will take this off subject lets just accept that new bolts should be used.The whole bolts thing can use up a thread of its own no trouble at all.

In my searching for info on 1.5j building I still find it difficult to get all the little details although the whole subject is old news for most.Therefore I will post as many details as I can within this thread.

I think we have covered the head costs debate well enough but dont forget the welding and machining of the water or oil gallery.Just waiting on some info back from Manny on a few little details................

[1jzracing]

hey Pete

interesting thread, what welding has to be done to the head???

i understood it to be a direct bolt on

im pretty sure 2jzgte and 1jzgte pistons are both forged, they are not ceramic coated, still good for some really big power

i did some tests measuring and re-using rod and main cap bolts and found it totally safe to re-use them many times (nearly 15!!) before the yeald starts to run away, however not sure about head bolts, i would use new but not convinced its essential

i have reused old bearings with no problems, keep them in order

i would put new rings in, engines with new rings are so nice. search for a set from another engine that fits, i found 3sgte rings fit the 1j at a fraction the cost, but 2j has a slightly thicker top ring

if the old ones dont bed you have an engine that needs to be pulled again ..... new head gasket many hours .... much dissapointment etc etc.

still interested to hear results if you do use them again, often thought of doing the same with just a light hone on the bore

shame you had to spend so much on the head i have a couple of good ones here

.... maybe that budget is an alcoholic

keep us up to date

ps just checked no $ yet, will post those plates as soon as its in