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Thread: Tick tick tick... name that sound...

  1. #1
    Forum Member Grease Monkey
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    Default Tick tick tick... name that sound...

    Hey all,

    One year on and i STILL cant find the source of this damned tick!!! Could you guys please have a lil listen to this vid and give me your thoughts?

    Cant find any exhaust manifold leaks? injectors have been cleaned? valve clearances are all very very close to factory spec (rev 3 3sge inlet cam/hks 252 exh with JUN valve springs)?

    Only does it at idle but sounds horrific. Goes away over 1.5 - 2k.

    Thinking possibly external wastegate leak? EGR has been deleted btw.

    Im running an open pcv but that doesnt make alot of diffrence...

    Please excuse the state of the car lol. Will be wrapped soon as its finished. Backwards TTE vent n rear arches etc, was late for a night shift and was rushing to test fit loads of new bits,

    I just cant figure it out.... Maybe one of you guys will hear this n be able to tell whats what.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pTGTXvU20c4

    As always i REALLY appreciate you guys helping me.

    Thanks again

    Chris

  2. #2
    2sc Breaker!!!! Backyard Mechanic bmxer54's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tick tick tick... name that sound...

    can't be sure obviously, does the sound go away when you depress the clutch pedal?
    My Rides:
    1x Brown St141 corona csx. powered by a gen 2 3sge, 1x RT142 turbo 1UZ, cd009 and G series, 1x Gj Sigma Scorpion injected and turbo'd, 1x KE30 2TG, w58 and F truetrac, 1x RT104 18RG, w58 and F truetrac

  3. #3
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    Default Re: Tick tick tick... name that sound...

    Hey thanks for the reply.

    Its still there when i press the clutch n disappears over 2k.

    Thinkin maybe hks cams need diffrent clearances to stock?

    Thanks again.

    Chris

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  4. #4
    Junior Member Backyard Mechanic
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    Default Re: Tick tick tick... name that sound...

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackcountryboy View Post
    Hey thanks for the reply.

    Its still there when i press the clutch n disappears over 2k.

    Thinkin maybe hks cams need diffrent clearances to stock?

    Thanks again.

    Chris

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    All aftermarket cams have different clearances due to different ramp angle and base circle radius. Do a google search for cams specs, hopefully can find using 3sgte on HKS listing. Should be numbers on back of rear journal of cams.

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Tick tick tick... name that sound...

    Mint. Thanks for confirming that!

    Had a look but couldnt find much on the net for 3sgte hks 256 cam clearances?

    The exh cam says 9.0 on it for the lift but couldnt see anything else. Gonna pulled em out again sat to remeasure all the shims. Will report back.

    Many thanks again.

    Chris



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    Last edited by Blackcountryboy; 13-09-2018 at 11:07 PM.

  6. #6
    Junior Member Backyard Mechanic jondee86's Avatar
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    Post Re: Tick tick tick... name that sound...

    Pulling the cams is only necessary if you are going to change a shim. The thickness of the shim (within reason) is immaterial; it is the clearance between the base circle and the shim that you need to measure. Clearance is needed to allow for the expansion of the valve as it heats up, and to provide some working tolerance for wear and assembly. Having a maximum and minimum range for the cold clearance also reduces the mumber of shim thicknesses required.

    The cam manufacturer allows for the clearance when designing the cam profile, but as tuners know, reducing the clearance results in a small increase in lift and duration. In a race engine every small bit counts, so setting the clearances to the bare minimum while the engine is hot is an old school technique.

    When comparing manufacturers recommendations for aftermarket cams it is unusual to see much variation. On 4AGE "road spec" cams, the numbers are usually 0.20mmIN and 0.25mmEX. For the 3SG(SXE10) TODA specify 0.25 and 0.30, but I haven't seen any numbers for aftremarket cams on the GTE engine. These are said to be the clearances for stock cams...

    3SGTE: Valve clearance (Cold)
    Intake: 0.15 - 0.25mm (0.006 - 0.010 in)
    Exhaust: 0.20 - 0.30mm (0.008 - 0.012 in)

    The most important thing is to get all the clearances to be near enough the same. Then either they are all quiet or they all tick

    Cheers... jondee86
    Last edited by jondee86; 14-09-2018 at 09:07 AM. Reason: typo...

  7. #7
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    Default Re: Tick tick tick... name that sound...

    Hey Jon

    Hope your well fella. Thanks for the reply and info.

    Gonna whip off the cam cover tmrw n measure every clearance.

    Will post my findings. Praying i dont have to pulled the cams again. Also bought a better micrometer to get an accurate reading. Used verniers last time n it may have been my downfall.

    Many thanks again.

    Chris

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  8. #8
    Junior Member Too Much Toyota oldcorollas's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tick tick tick... name that sound...

    You are using feeler gauge to check clearances?

    Do you have oil pressure at idle?
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  9. #9
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    Default Re: Tick tick tick... name that sound...

    Hey thanks for the reply. Yeah using metric feel gauge and have 50-60 psi cold, about 35 ish hot. Gonna buy a lad of new shims next week n tight up all the clearances by maybe 0.1mm n see what that does.

    18 hg vac. 13.5. - 14 AFR. Idles like crap. Sounds like a impreza.

    Pretty sure theres no vac, boost or manifold leaks (spoke tested and used sorry water.).

    Might just swap the head!

    Thanks again

    Chris



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  10. #10
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    Default Re: Tick tick tick... name that sound...

    Oh its v low on power under 2k and knocks under low load. Plugs are black n sooty.

    180 cold compression. 150 hot give or take 10pdi across all pots.

    Timings spot on 10 btdc. 22 degrees advance at idle.

    Just cant figure it all out lol... Still...

    Will post some screen shots of my base map, might be something daft... I hope...

    Thanks

    Chris

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  11. #11
    Junior Member Backyard Mechanic jondee86's Avatar
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    Exclamation Re: Tick tick tick... name that sound...

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackcountryboy View Post
    Timings spot on 10 btdc. 22 degrees advance at idle.
    Not sure what to make of this... IIRC you have an aftermarket ECU, so the "Jump the terminals and set base timing to 10 deg" routine should not apply. Providing you have calibrated the ECU to the engine by locking the ECU at (say) 15 deg and then adjusting the distributor (or ECU trigger settings) to get the timing light showing 15 deg, the ECU will run the timing you have set in your ignition map.

    IMO 22 deg BTDC is too much advance at idle. The fact that you say you are getting some knocking at low load tends to bear this out. Try dropping the timing around idle back to 15 deg and see what kind of difference it makes.

    If the camshaft shim clearances are within the factory specs and all reasonably close, then hold off changing shims until after checking the ignition and cam timing. If the engine has spent a good while just idling, then you can expect the plugs to be a bit sooty. Probably not enough heat in the combustion chambers to get the plugs up to operating temperature.

    Cheers... jondee86

  12. #12
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    Default Re: Tick tick tick... name that sound...

    Hey Jon,

    Thanks for all the info again/advice. The ec came off a stockish running st205 running a v similar turbo (s148 hybrid... Im running a gt2860rs).

    I set the max timing to 0 on the ecu then dialed in 10 btdc (as per the LINK manual). Cams are zeroed (252 3sge inlet at -6 the hks exh is +2).

    Gonna pull some timing at idle like you think n see if that helps. Over 2k it sounds alot better.

    Rest of the Cars finished ALMOST just that damn tick n rough running to work on n its mot/mapping time: )

    Ive also individually earthed everything important (map, coil, injectors) just to make sure. Sparks bright white n the fuels fresh.

    On thought tho dunno what you guys think but the fuel keeps going dark over weeks (orange with gum/varnish) so im thinkin of putting an after market fuel call in cos the tanks like 24 old. Have cleaned it last yr but maybe its contaminating fuel n thats the root of all the misery lol.

    Used stab -il n NF octane booster but still runs like a dog.

    Thanks again.

    Chris

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  13. #13
    Forum Member Grease Monkey
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    Default Re: Tick tick tick... name that sound...

    Btw apologies for all the spelling mistakes, at Work and texting on the sly without my boss telling me off lol. Predictive texts not the best.

    Love Toymods. Chatting with you guys makes a 12 hour shift a whole lot better!

    Thanks

    Chris

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  14. #14
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    Default Re: Tick tick tick... name that sound...

    Hey all,

    Pulled some timing at idle n low load. No change.

    Changed the fuel, n checked, compression (150 hot). Spark (white), and fuel then realised no1 cylinders not fitting again!!!!!

    Plug was wet with fuel and the injector noid light confirmed...

    Not firings def valve related...

    Why would one cylinders not fire but still have good compression???

    Goin back tmrw with new feeler guages and a diffrent micrometer to check clearances...

    Cheers

    Chris

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  15. #15
    Junior Member Backyard Mechanic jondee86's Avatar
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    Post Re: Tick tick tick... name that sound...

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackcountryboy View Post
    Why would one cylinders not fire but still have good compression???
    There is no logical reason (other than maybe a broken valve spring) if the mechanical components are all working as they should. You could try swapping the plug from #1 to some other cylinder, and see if the problem moves with the plug. If #1 still does not fire, swap the #1 injector to another cylinder and see if the problem stays with the injector.

    If the engine is running on three cylinders and your WBO2 gauge is showing 13.5-14 AFR's, then your mixture is going to be richer than that. A cylinder that does not fire adds oxygen to the exhaust and shows as a lean reading. If power comes back, the engine smoothes out and the ticking stops after 2000rpm, most likely the 4th cylinder is coming on line. The heat of compression can sometimes be enough to clear a plug that has been cold fouled with fuel.

    If your AFR drops a full ratio when you ease the revs up past 2000 (so as to not trigger any sudden enrichment), I would suspect a fuel, ignition or timing problem rather than mechanical one. If the car runs fine at normal road speed... smooth and responsive, then there can't be much wrong. But idling brings a lot of ECU corrections into play, and if these are not correct you can get problems, especially after prolonged idling. An engine needs a bit of lean cruising now and then to get the combustion chambers nice and hot, especially if you are using a cold heat range plug.

    I don't recall your engine being so grumpy at idle a year ago. So keep the door open for anything that you might have changed since then.

    Cheers... jondee86

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