New 4age build thread, advice appreciated

[Noisy 4age]

Hi fellas,

I'm putting together a smallport 4age based around Kelford's 193-b cams https://www.kelfordcams.com/nz/193-b-camshaft-set.html
and will be running a Megsasquirt ECU on Premium 98 fuel (Australia).

The head will have the combustion chambers deshrouded as per the TRD Bible and the casting marks in the ports cleaned up a bit. TODA valve springs and stock shim setup, silvertop ITB's and a TRD 0.8mm head gasket.

Bottom end will have Lightweight flywheel and rods. I'm hoping to get away with stock smallport pistons if they are good enough? Block will be skimmed to zero deck height and the remaining C/R increased through the TRD gasket and head skimming.

Is anyone currently running these cams and if so how do they perform?

What kind of compression ratio should I be aiming for with a setup like this?

I might even start a bit of a build thread if there seems to be any interest in the project.

Thanks guys,
Alex.

[oldcorollas]

nice! which MS and code?
build threads are always good.

[Noisy 4age]

It's a self assembled Megasquirt 2 running the MS2/Extra code. I've been playing around with it on Tunerstudio and it seems like a pretty trick piece of kit so far.
The plan is to use the stock distributor modified to be a single 24-1 cam sensor and fire the coil straight from the MS unit.

It'll be going into an AE92 when it's done too.

[oldeskewltoy]

Target compression ratio 11.75:1.

It would be possible to get close to that beginning with stock 10.3:1 pistons. You would have to take about .050" off the head to get near the #s you want. Only problem with original pistons are the piston ring lands could use better support. OEM type pistons have a open slit for the oil rings to evacuate the oil, where as stronger designs use a series of holes - the holes support the ring lands better then the slit.

[Noisy 4age]

Cheers mate. I was actually hoping you'd take the bait sooner or later.

Compared to most of the aftermarket stuff I've seen (oversize valve reliefs and huge crown heights) the stock topography looks much better. If I'm dropping cash I want something a bit more thought out than the current crop of shelf pistons I've seen so far.

Did you ever end up getting many takers on your design? If you're still doing them I might actually be interested in a set.
They were pretty close to what I would've done. Minimal valve reliefs (It's going to be an interference engine with these cams anyway), low crown height for their compression ratio, full skirt and lightweight gudgeon pins.

[oldeskewltoy]

sent you pm

[Noisy 4age]

Few parts, I'm away from the engine for a few more weeks but will post photos of my progress as it happens.

[Noisy 4age]

Well quite a bit has happened over the past couple of weeks.

Block and crank back from cleaning
https://ibb.co/kZU9Ed

Deburred inside the head and around the buckets
https://ibb.co/fPAuZd

ITB's and adapter

[Noisy 4age]

Some combustion chamber and port work to come when I get a chance to upload the photos.

[webby]

Looks like a good setup, very similar to mine. The pistons will be ok as long as they don’t get too hot! I run a micro squirt and I think the ms2-extra codes are fantastic. I also run a flex fuel sensor and wish I went for more compression now...
I did try running the stock dizzy with the 24-1 teeth but could never get it so run right, it kept loosing sync and it would die at idle every now and then, in high sight it could have just been my filtering settings. I ended up going to a crank Hall effect sensor before that dies and now I run a falcon AU VR sensor driven of the exhaust cam gear with i tooth ground off. Works a treat and I have full sequential injection and COP with one sensor.
Good luck with the build. Don’t forget to port the oil pump and run an oil cooler too

[Noisy 4age]

wish I went for more compression now...

I did try running the stock dizzy with the 24-1 teeth but could never get it so run right, it kept loosing sync and it would die at idle every now and then

Don’t forget to port the oil pump and run an oil cooler too[/QUOTE]


I'm thinking to aim a bit higher with compression and if it does knock when tuned correctly (There is A LOT of mis information out there between tuners as far as mixture strength and particularly spark timing goes, but that is a whole other topic) I can skim a touch off the pistons (not with the factory cast items though) OR open up the chambers a bit more to drop the CR a little. And if it doesn't knock I can bump it up a bit further.

I was getting the odd synch issue when playing with it in TunerStudio, but was spinning the dizzy with a hand drill and put it down to that. I would REALLY like to run a sensor off the flywheel teeth, but would still need a second sensor to fill in as the "missing tooth". I have no immediate plans to go COP or sequential injection so am hoping I can get the dizzy to work (I have a few plans in store for that too).

I'm currently waiting for my new oil pump, but porting it will be the first thing I do after making sure the internals are within tolerance. I was originally going to use the factory oil cooler setup, but I believe that only bleeds off excess oil above a certain PSI and is not constant flow like most of the aftermarket stuff.

[Noisy 4age]

Got the head back from the shop today.

No pictures yet, but the seats have been cut to the TRD bible ae92 spec and the head has been skimmed to 34CC (I deshrouded and finished one chamber before skimming, so now all I have to do is open the others up to match).

Got half way through a line hone before the shop realised they couldn't finish the job, so now I have to find somewhere else willing to pick up where they left off.

[Noddy]

I am about to bolt mine together this week, should be getting everything back from the machine shop tomorrow. Its a big port on an early block. The crank has been tidied up with all the galeries cleaned and sealed with grub screws. Match ground ACL Race bearings and a set of ARP stud's. We made a new fly wheel. Pics attached, for a 200mm clutch. Obviously all ballanced.

MaxSpinning rods with custom Wiseco pistions. 83.5mm. The head is fairly std, debured ports, HKS 272 cams, new guides and just a small adjustment in chamber. Again ARP stud set and a customised Commetic head gasket. Comperssion is around 13.5:1.

45mm webbers delivering a 105 octane race fuel. $8.38/L hurts a little.

It will be interesting to compare the results.

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[webby]

Wow 83.5mm was that a typo? How thick are the cylinder walls?

[Noddy]

83.5 is not a typo. I don't think there is any extra in it to go bigger. It was 83 in the last build which had a very flat, hyperutectic pistion with only 10.5:1 comp. I'd have to have a dig to find all the details but same head, still with biscuits, lightest of the 20v rods, 5kg std fly...
151rwhp @ 8800. Held good power up to 9100.

I might have to spend some time and do a build thread on it. In a nut shell (and as far as I can verify) it was built by Toyota for a 1 make TRD cup and stayed with Toyota until the early 2000's. Sold to a Tokyo based work shop and raced in N1 and entry N2 category. Sold late 2000's to a private guy in Osaka who raced it also. I bought it in 2012 and imported it to aust. I do hill climbs, mostly super sprints and some special ones like leyburn sprints and Noosa Hill.

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