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Thread: 4AG headwork, now block too

  1. #91
    SC14 7AGZE Grease Monkey
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    Default Re: 4AG headwork, now block too

    To clarify, I was talking about a stock 16v largeport bluetop engine. It comes with 115hp 100ft/lbs stock... which minus 17% drivetrain loss would equate to 95rwhp 83ft/lbs. To claim a 40hp & 20 ft/lbs gain to 135rwhp 103ft/lbs by just a standalone and cams (no intake manifold, no ITBs, no porting, and keeping all emissions equipment) is far fetched on a 1.6L Naturally Aspirated engine. Thats all I was saying.

    Not a smallport, not a custom intake manifold or ITB'ed engine or full out race engine with no emissions equipment, not a Holden V8........ a stock bluetop 4A-GE. Yes, 40/20 gain is working magic.
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  2. #92
    Gary Motorsport Inc. Too Much Toyota takai's Avatar
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    Default Re: 4AG headwork, now block too

    Quote Originally Posted by turbo4agte
    To clarify, I was talking about a stock 16v largeport bluetop engine. It comes with 115hp 100ft/lbs stock... which minus 17% drivetrain loss would equate to 95rwhp 83ft/lbs. To claim a 40hp & 20 ft/lbs gain to 135rwhp 103ft/lbs by just a standalone and cams (no intake manifold, no ITBs, no porting, and keeping all emissions equipment) is far fetched on a 1.6L Naturally Aspirated engine. Thats all I was saying.

    Not a smallport, not a custom intake manifold or ITB'ed engine or full out race engine with no emissions equipment, not a Holden V8........ a stock bluetop 4A-GE. Yes, 40/20 gain is working magic.

    Not at all. See here:
    Quote Originally Posted by Schmitt
    Slightly off topic.
    FWIW my completely standard bigport 4a with just a microtech ecu made 107hp at the wheels. And that has also been confirmed on four different dynos, 1 of which was at the dyno day at SAS. It was also down on compression. So with a decent condition motor and a set of

    30rwhp out of a cam is NOT unreasonable.
    -Chris | Garage takai - Breaking cars since 1998
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  3. #93
    Olde mechanic Carport Converter oldeskewltoy's Avatar
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    Default Re: 4AG headwork, now block too

    Camshafts have been chosen!

    226 degree @ .050" lift
    lift to be 8.38mm
    centers @112 degrees
    Information is POWER... learn the facts!!

  4. #94
    i wrote the Automotive Encyclopaedia roadsailing's Avatar
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    Default Re: 4AG headwork, now block too

    whats that translate to in jap "bigger" duration?
    like to drift? live in victoria?
    www.vicdrift.com

    now targeting: targets

    formerly shinybluesteel

  5. #95
    Olde mechanic Carport Converter oldeskewltoy's Avatar
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    Default Re: 4AG headwork, now block too

    Quote Originally Posted by roadsailing
    whats that translate to in jap "bigger" duration?
    264 type... cam timing is nearly stock at 112, many other 264 type cams use 105 as the cam center, this lowers DCR by 2/10s. my DCR is 9.67. Using anyone elses 264 would make my DCR 9.93. My variables are below.

    bore: 3.208
    stroke: 3.031
    rod: 4.803
    static CR: 10.7 to 1

    with my goals, I decided to trade some DCR for a bit of lift.
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  6. #96
    Olde mechanic Carport Converter oldeskewltoy's Avatar
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    Default Re: 4AG headwork, now block too





    This is her first dyno run. The initial map was only written to 7500 rpm(engine and cams are good to 8500)

    141whp @ 7468, 108#s wheel torque @ 6127rpm.

    Engine numbers(back calculated by their dyno) 164hp @7468, 128ft/# 6127rpm.

    Numbers very close to and in some cases exceeding blacktops. This is also her first pull, the new ECU is barely talking at this stage(I still can't get idle under 1500 in closed loop) I expect peak hp to exceed 150whp, and I expect peak torque to exceed 110#/ft also measured @ the wheels
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  7. #97
    Low rep Grease Monkey
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    Default Re: 4AG headwork, now block too


  8. #98
    Low rep Grease Monkey
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    Default Re: 4AG headwork, now block too

    [IMG]<a href="http://s704.photobucket.com/albums/ww49/pornstr20v/?action=view&current=31102009343.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i704.photobucket.com/albums/ww49/pornstr20v/th_31102009343.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket" ></a>[/IMG]

    [IMG]<a href="http://s704.photobucket.com/albums/ww49/pornstr20v/?action=view&current=31102009345.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i704.photobucket.com/albums/ww49/pornstr20v/th_31102009345.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket" ></a>[/IMG]

    [IMG]<a href="http://s704.photobucket.com/albums/ww49/pornstr20v/?action=view&current=31102009349.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i704.photobucket.com/albums/ww49/pornstr20v/th_31102009349.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket" ></a>[/IMG]

  9. #99
    Low rep Grease Monkey
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    Default Re: 4AG headwork, now block too

    sorry abt that guys












  10. #100
    Junior Member Grease Monkey markiitourerv's Avatar
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    Default Re: 4AG headwork, now block too

    umm, yeah ok, and this is relevant because....

  11. #101
    Olde mechanic Carport Converter oldeskewltoy's Avatar
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    Default Re: 4AG headwork, now block too

    Now THAT is emissions complaint....... SWEEEEET

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  12. #102
    Village Idiot Automotive Encyclopaedia
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    Default Re: 4AG headwork, now block too

    do you guys have to do this every 6 months?

  13. #103
    Olde mechanic Carport Converter oldeskewltoy's Avatar
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    Default Re: 4AG headwork, now block too

    hahahahaha... no... the certificate is good for 6 months... note there isn't a plate.
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  14. #104
    Village Idiot Automotive Encyclopaedia
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    Default Re: 4AG headwork, now block too

    ok i get it. we only have to 'roadworthy' our cars here once here in VIC and thats it - its valid for the life of the car - example my 1966 XP had its roadworthy in 1968 when my father bought it. technically it is still roadworthy - although its about eleventy billion miles from it.

  15. #105
    Olde mechanic Carport Converter oldeskewltoy's Avatar
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    Default Re: 4AG headwork, now block too

    thought I'd add an update to this...

    The tune back then was still pretty bad.... it had a vacuum leak (using an AFM T/B instead of a MAP T/B you'll get that leak....) and a ignition map that was mostly undone, call it a break in tune only



    this ignition map goes with the dyno run previously posted


    a 2nd dyno run was done last year, around this time (Feb 2010) and she planted a bit more power



    That ignition map was a bit more complete, but it also was a bit conservative




    The ignition map has since changed....



    To reflect real world use, and is now far more complete, and a bit more aggressive. There is no new dyno to show the improvements, but I do have 3 passes @ the local drag strip that tells some interesting information......




    The short version.... she ran 15.77 @ 88.8 mph. Dig a bit further though and you see a car that NEEDS a better driver - the best reaction time I could muster was .716

    my horrible 60 foot times, as compared to the overall run show that a better driver can likely make my car do passes in the sub 15 second range, and she should break out above 90 mph.

    Not too bad for an emissions compliant 1606cc 4AGE, T50, and 3.90 open final drive.
    Information is POWER... learn the facts!!

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