This thread is dedicated to information about the Toyota 4.5L 32V DOHC Diesel V8.
My personal goal is to determine wether it is much bigger than the 1UZ, and thus if it would fit in a Toyota Crown. The side-effect of this research is that anyone considering a 1UZ swap may also consider the V8 Diesel as well (when it becomes cheaper!).
My impression of this motor:
If I can make it fit, it will be awesome. At idle it sounds like a truck engine, where as a slight rev gives off that it is a V8. With 430Nm available from 1200RPM, it will push the Crown with ease
Relevant Engine Data
Maximum Power: 151KW @ 3400RPM
Maximim Torque: 430Nm @ 1200-3200RPM
Comp Ratio: 16.8:1
Fuel Injection: Direct Injection
(Toyota Pressroom, MS Excel format.)
Servicable Engine Mass: 357kg, including water and oil. (Toysrme 2007, Toyota Nation)
I visited a Toyota Dealer yesterday in my spare time and got a good look at the engine. Unfortunately I only had a 1m tape measure. I wanted to measure the width of my engine bay in comparison with the Landcruiser. I was advised by the Toyota Sales Department I should contact the Parts Division as they may have more information, so perhaps I will have more accurate information to add to this thread.
The engine appears to be 70-74cm wide. I dived under the engine bay and noticed the chassis rails were roughly straight, measured their width to also be in the 70-74cm range. I was rushed because I thought I was making the Toyota Sales Representatives uneasy
The exhaust headers thankfully do not extend past the width of the engine.
Comparison with 1UZ:
Some excellent pictures provided by a member from Lextreme named 'Striker' show the 1UZ is 62cm wide.
The engine is wider than the 1UZ by up to 6cm either side which is bad, however, what is most important to me is the exhaust clearance. I measured the height from the engine mount on the 1VD to the top of the exhaust, it was 13 cm. Scaling estimation for the 1UZ puts the height of the exhaust at approximately 11cm. I do not know if this will provide some extra clearance?
The 1UZ masses 175-220kg (Peewee 2005, Lextreme; Mos 2007, Toymods respectively). This means at worst case, the 1VD is 182kg heavier. Gianttomato (2008, Toymods) estimates the 5M motor is around 200kg. Consider a front spring upgrade!
- New Toyota Diesel Family, Diesel v8 Land Cruiser on sale now
- Toyota Industries, VD Diesel Engine
- (Undergoing conversion)1VD-FTV V8 into 100 series
That is all I have on the motor right now. It would be appreciated if anyone else can contribute any information.
We've got 2 blocks sitting in dead parts out the back at work. And the heads/rest of the engine in a box from when the coppers rolled it and left it running.
The ones in the 70 series have single turbo and a really shitty crossover pipe at the back of the engine. Looks really restrivtive. 200's have twins obviously. I can sit the heads on the block perhaps and measure width.
the parts dept wont have any info im afraid.
you will have to measure it.
i do foresee an issue with this conversion though
you car will look like a piece of that twisted pasta stuff when u plant it
Last edited by Mr Revhead; 11-05-2009 at 03:41 PM.
I DONT WORK FOR TOYOTA ANYMORE
please, no more PMs!
Why the crown is full chassis which is no different to the 4wd's that house it.
If in doubt power out
that comment wasnt made in total seriousness
I DONT WORK FOR TOYOTA ANYMORE
please, no more PMs!
Hi,Originally Posted by RONA
The difference is in the construction. 4wd's, and 2wd Hilux utilities, have a chassis that is a full box section. The chassis on a Crown is mainly constructed of C section which of course is less rigid than a full box section.
MS112, you certainly have an interesting project planned kudos to you.
I entertained the idea of putting one of these engines into my Surf. The thought was good but after measuring one up I realised the job of making it all fit would be too hard for me.
Hello Gavatron,Originally Posted by Gavatron
If you could please measure one up, that will be incredibly helpful.
Just an enquiry, if one of the engines are damaged beyond repair, would you be willing to sell one so I could use it as a test fit piece?
I should also point out the Twin Turbo version, at 650Nm, is considered too excessive
Hello PeteHOriginally Posted by PeteH
The 430Nm figure has me a little worried. Though I point to Sean's MS-75 and also the UZS131 Crown V8 as examples of the chassis handling engines with strong torque. Of course, the torque variations of a Diesel are a lot stronger than a Petrol motor. The peak torque can be as much as 150% that of average torque. However, I think the drive train will fail somewhere before the chassis bends.
Plus, there is the rumour that the Crown chassis is derived from a light truck.
Thanks PeteH. It will take years to eventuate, however. The engine is still quite expensive at this stage. And it may not even fit. My main concern is that it will foul on the upper control arms for the front suspension.MS112, you certainly have an interesting project planned kudos to you.
Both are pretty rooted. One is a complete engine in bits, one is just the block. The complete one is counted for but I can probably get you the block.
I didn't mean for my coment to be taken that your Crown chassis wouldn't be up to the task, more I was just clarifying Rona's comment on the donor vehicle and the Crown having the same chassis. Both are vehicles do have a seperate body and chassis construction, but when look a little closer the chassis of a Crown and 4wd are different. The 4wd chassis is the truck like of the two.
Anyhow I'd be willing to bet that a Crown and it's chassis would be deeemed suitable in strength for this motor swap when engineered for road use in NSW. And yes the example of Sean's MS75 would certainly say it is up to it.
Enough of me filling your useful thread with crap......I want to see more tech specs
Last edited by PeteH; 12-05-2009 at 11:55 AM.
Doesnt the 1VD have piston problems Gav ?, ive heard of a couple of cases allready on exploroz. They sure as hell are very rattly when cold.
Most common rail diesels have non rebuildable injectors that cost $1000 each which by 100000klm are getting tired .
There have been cold start rattle issues with most of the common rail diesels. Updated injectors for repeat offenders. There are currently ECU reprograms I have to do at work on 70 and 200 series 1VD's that are within a VIN range. They stop most cases of rattling.
Oil usage is usually due to the vacuum pump.
The diesel engine would have to be exactly the same as the 1uz to fit into an MS112. My MS83, which has the same chassis as the MS112, has only minimal room either side of the engine and that's with the right exhaust manifolds and the lean to the left that the UZS131 had standard.
If you were willing to go to a rack and pinion steering you would have a better chance of fitting it.
have u done a weight on it? it is not a light engine. there are heaps of injector issues with these engines
Originally Posted by cambelt
the same units are available at united desiel for $350
350*8 still equals lots...
are the 70 motors and 200 motors the same in regards to firing of injectors?
how many times do they fire per cycle? definately dont sound like a single fire injector, much too quiet
what box you gonna put behind it? i would keep the standard auto, nice box if you ask my boss. only issue he has with it is that it likes to launch in second and then kick back, even on gentle starts he reckons.. anyone heard anything about this?
and 650nm is not excessive, if your gonna do it, do it properly
have you seen the slideshow of the bloke crossing that flooded river? the electronics are obviously pretty well protected which surprised me
MY RIDE, 2 Door LHD KE70 sedan with 1G HKS stroker: http://www.toymods.org.au/forums/showthread.php?t=51760
Punctuation is the difference between 'I helped my Uncle Jack off his horse' and 'I helped my uncle jack off his horse.'
70 series only come in manual. 200 series motor would be exceptionally gay to get running in anything else.
Up to 5 injections per cycle.
I don't know how good those $350 injectors would be. When we replace them, you have to get the right injectors to begin with, then once installed go into a utility on the Intelligent Tester and input the correction codes for all 8 injectors into the ECU memory. That's how fine the tolerances are.
gavatron there the exact same injector. He has had nothing but probs with his v8 troopy but his mate with the same motor in the GXL has been fine. HIt has been that much of a problem that he prob won't buy a new toyo again.
Fair enough then. What problems was he having if you don't mind me asking?
injectors flowing to much that it is going straight into the sump. has had clutch shudder, gearbox has had gears replaced and now the engine is so noisy he is just waiting for it to blow up and toyota won't replace the motor after it has been back that many times.
Hello Gavatron,Originally Posted by Gavatron
I would still be most interested in the block. It would still allow me to determine, roughly, if the engine will fit. Also, I would be able to determine bellhousing bolt patterns, and locations of engine mounts etc.
Hello PeteH,Originally Posted by PeteH
It did bring the issue to my attention however -- it forced me to at least confirm with some evidence that the Crown chassis will survive.
Hello Dave,Originally Posted by cambelt
The beauty of a diesel is that if I were really desperate, I could theoretically retro-fit a mechanical injection system. For example, two Toyota 2L diesel pumps, run 45 degrees out of phase of each other can replicate a V8 diesel inline injection pump, and the cylinder capacity is about right (0.6L versus 0.5625L).
Would be a hell of a task!
Hello Shane,Originally Posted by crownv8
The MS112 and MS83 chassis are the same? That is really handy information right there.
I am already resigned to the fact a rack and pinion conversion is most likely a must.
What I am really concerned about now is clearance between the upper front suspension control arms. The steering can be altered, the front suspension is a different matter*... I am hoping in a couple of weeks I will have an answer as to the distance between the suspension control arms.
*Convert to struts? Strewth...
Hello love ke70,Originally Posted by love ke70
I would think there would be clearance issues with the twin turbo version of this motor. As for the gearbox... I may be able to use the landcruiser gearbox, from what I have read, the transfer case is separate to the H150F gearbox. Will probably have to alter the transmission tunnel to fit it!
Hello Fish,Originally Posted by Fish
According to a picture posted on Toyota Nation which I cannot find the original source of, the Servicable Engine Mass is 357kg, including oil and water. (Toysrme 2007, Toyota Nation)
Relevant Engine Data section has been updated.
As for injector problems, I think by the time I get hold of one of these engines, teething problems will probably be fixed.
Thanks for all the replies to this thread.