7KE and 4KE injection manifolds PICS

[oldcorollas]

so here's pics from my page.. http://www.materials.unsw.edu.au/~sford/7ke4ke.html

7KE has 10" runner, 4KE has 20" runner (valve to plenum)
7KE has 50mm TB (and variable TPS), 4KE has 40mm TB (and switch type TPS)
7KE has 195cc injectors (skinny type), 4KE has 145cc injectors (normal toyota type)


http://t-rex.materials.unsw.edu.au/~sford/pics/7ke4ke/7ke4ke1.jpg
http://t-rex.materials.unsw.edu.au/~sford/pics/7ke4ke/7ke4ke2.jpg
http://t-rex.materials.unsw.edu.au/~sford/pics/7ke4ke/7ke4ke3.jpg
http://t-rex.materials.unsw.edu.au/~sford/pics/7ke4ke/7ke4ke4.jpg
http://t-rex.materials.unsw.edu.au/~sford/pics/7ke4ke/7ke4ke5.jpg
http://t-rex.materials.unsw.edu.au/~sford/pics/7ke4ke/7ke4ke6.jpg
http://t-rex.materials.unsw.edu.au/~sford/pics/7ke4ke/7ke4ke7.jpg

[Dom-AE71]

http://www.fluidzone.com/liddertown/pics/EFI/ke-01.jpg
http://www.fluidzone.com/liddertown/pics/EFI/ke-02.jpg
http://www.fluidzone.com/liddertown/pics/EFI/ke-03.jpg
http://www.fluidzone.com/liddertown/pics/EFI/ke-04.jpg
http://www.fluidzone.com/liddertown/pics/EFI/ke-05.jpg

some more photos of a 4K-E manifold for everyone :)

[mrshin]

That 4K one could almost only be rivalled by the 'efi 202' unit for length:D

Were they actually trying to get some kind of low down urge from the 4K hey?:P

[oldcorollas]

actually, it is very similar to the 2TG, the EFI 202, the XF4.1....

basically, at the time, the current technology was to have long runners to try and promotr torque down low... but this only helps really if you have small ports to help increase the velocity..

both the 4K and 7K have 30mm internal diameter runners.. same as the large port heads, which i think is too big (perhaps) for a street 4K anyway..

but yeah.. it was in line with current trends at the time (early 80's)

i used the 7K due to time constraints, but the 4K one positions the plenum better for turbo apps ;)

[Hurricane]

What cars do you get the EFI manifoilds off? Are they out of the vans or something? and are there hard to get and wire up?

[74ROLLA]

What cars do you get the EFI manifoilds off? Are they out of the vans or something? and are there hard to get and wire up?

Out of Toyota Liteace/Townace
Hard to get - Yes, unless you buy the whole motor from i have found? ($$$).

If you buy the whole motor, the 7KE will require alot of modifications to fit in a KE Corolla due to the extra length of the motor (stroke) - I'm sure Old Corolla's could confirm exactly what needs to be done!

Best to fit the injection to a 3/4/5K in a KE Corolla

[Hokey]

You can also import them from NZ as they came out in the Starlets. The good RWD ones which we did not get over here:mad:

[74ROLLA]

You can also import them from NZ as they came out in the Starlets. The good RWD ones which we did not get over here:mad:

I forgot about the KP Starlets! :(

[WDE_BDY]

You can also import them from NZ as they came out in the Starlets. The good RWD ones which we did not get over here:mad:

Jap spec only, not NZ new. Realistically if you are going to mod the motor then custom is a definite option considering what people try to charge for the factory setups.

Callum

[oldcorollas]

US 1981-1983 KP61 starlet also got the 4KE injection (which is where mine is from)
the 7KE is from the Townace SBV around 2000 model.

both 7KE and 4KE systems seem to go for between $200-400 depending on completeness and extras..

i used the 7KE initially cos it has 50mm TB instead of 40mm, and it had a variable TPS instead of switch, but the 7KE has the thinner denso style injectors making larger ones harder to source.
the 4KE uses normal style injectors, so almost all other toyota injectors go straight in... i would probablyuse 4KE with a larger TB fpor a forced induction motor...

both types, when used with a MEgasquirt make for a very cheap injection system (use either electronic dizzy from 4KE/5K, or points dizzy with Jaycar HEI)..
any questions, i am happy to answer.. i osold my 4KE gear, but still have 7KE gear installed on car..

Cya, Stewart

[PMP020]

ive recently purchased a 4KE injection setup, complete apart from computer.

stu how much would i roughly be looking at for a megasquirt computer?

is it tru u can run the AC delco computers from camiras ect etc?

any help would be much appriciated.
cheers scott

[cambelt]

The sump hits the crossmember and unfortunatly the block skirt is 20 mm wider than 4 or 5 k so the earlyer sumps dont fit . The engine mounts fit on but due to the block being wider it doesnt bolt in 100% nicely.
A bit of panelbeating to the sump seams to work ok
Dave

[PMP020]

here is the 4KE manifold i just purchased
http://img90.imageshack.us/img90/9605/kefi01fq1.jpg
http://img101.imageshack.us/img101/9671/kefi02pv1.jpg

all i need is a computer?
any ideas what i can run successfuly?

cheers scott

[Cam-Rush]

I read an article about delco computers in Perth streetcar..i think it was called, they aound pretty good and not too hard to install, i'll have a look for the mag and write some of it up here if you want?
did you get that from madrolla68? he had one for sale on rollaclub...i was thinking of buying that.

[PMP020]

hey cam rush, that would be much appriciated if you could find me that article, any help will be awesum.
no it aint madrollas setup i bought it off ebay today :D

cheers scott

[Grega]

you could look to adapting a 4AGE setup to run it, or, as cam-rush has suggested - get a delco 1227808 ECU setup from a JD (MPFI) or JE Camira, and use that. with the kalmaker software you then have a programmable computer which is infintely adjustable.

[PMP020]

you rock grega
thanx heaps for that info, ill see what i can get through work 2moro.

cheers scott

[Grega]

yeah cool. let me know if i can help. i got some delco gear lying around here.
i think kalmaker thou is 995 for street pro 3

i like the 4AGE idea personally, but, as the cams ect are very different you may have issues trying to adapt the dizzy ect. nothing that couldn't be sorted BUT its not adjustable post tune.

[madrolla68]

The sump hits the crossmember and unfortunatly the block skirt is 20 mm wider than 4 or 5 k so the earlyer sumps dont fit . The engine mounts fit on but due to the block being wider it doesnt bolt in 100% nicely.
A bit of panelbeating to the sump seams to work ok
Dave

Are you referring to the 7K in a KE series car ,cause im in the process of fitting a 7K to my KE10..
Any tips you can give me.

[WDE_BDY]

http://www.zeroyon.com/forums/lofiversion/index.php/t7907.html

Madrolla, this link might help you for the 7k swap.
A mate on Club K considered swapping his supercharger setup off his 5K to a 7K but after buying one and stripping it down he decided it wasn't worth it without some substantial internal upgrades. I'm still intrigued by this swap, might consider it once a few other projects are out of the way.

Callum

[madrolla68]

http://www.zeroyon.com/forums/lofiversion/index.php/t7907.html

Madrolla, this link might help you for the 7k swap.
A mate on Club K considered swapping his supercharger setup off his 5K to a 7K but after buying one and stripping it down he decided it wasn't worth it without some substantial internal upgrades. I'm still intrigued by this swap, might consider it once a few other projects are out of the way.

Callum

I have heard a lot about the 7K's ,but hey until i try it i will never know.I mean they are a supposed to be an industrial engine so they should take some curry.

The &a series engine came factory turbo and these engines have the same rods so these should handle a little puff and maybe a little NOS>

[oldcorollas]

for megasquirt stuff

www.msefi.com

and to buy, from www.diyautotune.com

all you need is an MS1 vs V2.2 board...
with black case, it's US$140 plus post. plain case is US$134...

you would want to change the TPS to something that is variable, rather than switch, and you can ditch the AFM, as the MS uses onboard MAP anyway..

[PMP020]

hey thanx for the links stuart
the 1st one dosent work, i had a quikc look through the DIY site.

i fount he MS1 ecu, couldnt find it unassembled, only assembled for $240
wat is the 2.2? will that come with it?
i am very much new to all this new:rolleyes: EFI computer stuff.

im still stuk in carby n pionts land.
any more help would be much appricited from everyone

anyone that has used one of these computers before? some feedback.

cheers scott

[oldcorollas]

first link is the forums.. they seem to be down atm...

http://www.megasquirt.info/v22manual/mtabcon.htm is the megamanual... start readin ;)

V2.2 PCB just has a few less bits... i used it for the 4K tho.



the ones i was talking about
http://www.diyautotune.com/catalog/megasquirti-programmable-system-pcb22-black-case-p-128.html

http://www.diyautotune.com/catalog/megasquirti-programmable-system-pcb22-unassembled-p-28.html

but of course, the V3 is a bit better, and MS2 is looking good... but you can run fuel and spark on the V2.2 PCB with MS1 using "megasquirt n spark" firmware...

[bnicho]

I didn't even know the 7K existed until I saw this:

http://cgi.ebay.com.au/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ih=001&item=110002049776&rd=1&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT&rd=1

Looks like a great setup. :)

[joecoolmk2]

so do ALL liteaces have the fuel injection or just some of them? i'm lookin at buying a 1983 liteace, in tas if that makes a difference.

[oldcorollas]

umm as far as i know, the US starlet has 4KE injection. (KP61, around 1983)
the 7KE comes from Townace SBV, which was around 2000 model.

i am not sure i have ever reliably heard of a liteace EFI.. liteace has 5K? but i have also never heard of a 5K EFI ;)

where did you get your info joecoolmk2??

if you are looking at buying the car.. go and have a look or call the owner :P

[joecoolmk2]

umm as far as i know, the US starlet has 4KE injection. (KP61, around 1983)
the 7KE comes from Townace SBV, which was around 2000 model.

i am not sure i have ever reliably heard of a liteace EFI.. liteace has 5K? but i have also never heard of a 5K EFI ;)

where did you get your info joecoolmk2??

if you are looking at buying the car.. go and have a look or call the owner :P

yeah i should just go look at it. from info i've found they're a 4k(1300)

i saw someone mention liteaces on this thread or another thread, that's why i asked.

[Cam-Rush]

sorry pmp, i couldnt find that article, from what i can remember it wasnt all that difficult to hook up a delco, and they are had pretty cheaply at wreckers, so maybe just get one and have a crack!
i would be more inclined to go for what oldcorollas said, have you checked out the megasquirt website?
has anyone ever heard of anyone adapting 4AG efi setup or similar to a K motor? i wonder if it is worth doing on a powerful k motor?

what about someone adapting a set of 20V quads to a k!? that would be awesome!

sorry for drifting off the subject a little but im really excited now.

[oldcorollas]

delco ECU's need to be reprogrammed by Kalmaker... which used to be cheap, but now you need dongles etc, and is around $1K anyway.

i used the MS1 on my 4K and it was very easy to set up and tune. i will be using them on all my further projects until it can't do what i want. the only reason i would not use one was if i wanted coil on plug with 4 coils instead of waste spark.

i used 7KE injector which were around 195cc, 4AG starts around 210? but the normal toyota injectors don't fit in the 7K setup without fiddling... the rest of the 4AG is a bit useless... unless the TPS is variable type...even then, not much good.

the GSX550E bike (at least) has CV carbs with 30mm throat and almost perfect spacing for a K motor.. if i was going to do quads, i would start with them. i have some at home ;)
20V start at 43mm, it is probably a bit big for a K motor. and the spacing is well out.

even just using a set of sidedraughts as TB's on a normal manifold (with injector bosses welded in) would be a great start.

anyone thought about machining holes in the head for injectors?

[Mr Revhead]

ok, im going to drrraaaaag this back up...
injectors....
oldcorollas, you say different injectors are hard to source for a 7k manifold.... but you didnt say impossible... have you found some?

or

what would it take to make the manifold accept normal type injectors? just a quick bore out of the injector mount?

[oldcorollas]

ok, i had a look at some ST215 3SGTE injectors.. they look liek the same type, ie, thin, plastic body. so i would be looking at late 90's motors for them.

or

the injector sits on a plastic cup. the plastic cup sits in the manifold. the fat body of the normal injectors fouls on said plastic cup (not sure of the ends are same size or not, and not sure on length).
it should be very easy to machine up some alloy cups to press into the manifold, to hold normal injectors. as long as you get the rigth length between the cup and rail.. but you can work that out from the original injectors etc...
should be very easy :)

[Mr Revhead]

awesome, thanks
am about to embark on a project using a 7k manifold and am still in research/scrounge mode.... this thread has been useful
getting my hands on some ST215 injectors wont be hard... though they may be a little big! :eek:


hmmmm maybe those awful import D4 coronas have the same kind
ill be sticking my head under the bonnets of some cars at work... if i find ones that look liley ill report back!

[oldcorollas]

getting my hands on some ST215 injectors wont be hard... though they may be a little big! :eek:

i am not sure if they will fit.. eyeballing they look kinda similar..

big? i don't think so ;) they are only good for 200kw :D

[Mr Revhead]

yep.... i'll need to maybe smack em with a hammer to get them in then....

200kw...... oh is that all? maybe ill use 8 then..... :cool: